No Islam= No Conflict?
Posted: November 6, 2011 Filed under: articles by Sami Zaatari, Islamophobia, The News 10 Comments »Christian apologist and critic of Islam, David Wood, has recently posted a video on his AnsweringMuslims blog, the blog post can be viewed on the following link:
http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2011/11/islams-impact-on-world-affairs.html
The video in question is titled as ‘World is Peaceful without Islam’, and Wood has titled the blog article as ‘Islam’s Impact on World Affairs’. Now obviously as Wood has posted the video with the following blog title, it means he supports the contents of the video. Now in the video itself there is a man talking, he seems to be in an interview, and he lists a whole series of conflicts around the world, particularly in countries neighbored by the Muslim world, and so obviously the point that’s trying to be made is that wherever Islam seems to be, there’s a conflict happening and without it there would be peace.
Now before we actually analyze these conflicts we too can play the same game. For example, we too could make the argument that a world without Christianity would be a very peaceful place, after all one only has to study Christian history and see the vile brutality and violence that was committed under it’s reign, now off course que the drum roll and excuses from apologists such as Wood, which only sums up their inconsistency and how weak their methodology actually is. As the saying goes, you can’t have your cake and eat it.
Now to the actual video itself, I can’t obviously give a detailed analysis of each conflict mentioned, but I shall only highlight a few, after all if we simply reveal the weak analysis behind these conflicts, and how wrong they are, what’s the point in listening to each argument the person is making when it’s quite clear they have no clue as to what their talking about.
The Conflict in East Timor
It is almost laughable that the East Timor conflict is brought up, now off course to the politically ignorant (which most Islamophobes happen to be) anything that involves a country that happens to be Muslim must therefore equal a conflict related to Islam, it never occurred in the minds of some that one can be a Muslim and go to war for the sake of something other than Islam, i.e. not every Muslim who goes to war is doing it for Islam, off course such a basic concept is alien to the minds of Islamophobes.
If one had bothered to do a little homework, then one would learn that the leaders of Indonesia who had decided to invade East Timor were fueled by nationalistic reasons rather than religious, the conflict was not about Muslims VS None Muslims, in fact this argument becomes even more laughable when one comes to learn that Indonesia is ruled by secularism! Oh yes, how very religious isn’t it?
Secondly, what’s more laughable was that East Timor WAS ALREADY IN CONFLICT BEFORE ANY INDONESIAN INVASION, they were in engaged in their own civil war, so to argue that if Islam didn’t exist then there would be no violence in that area is almost mind numbing and shows the major depth of ignorance were dealing with here.
Thirdly (and this is the icing on the cake), the Indonesians HAD THE FULL SUPPORT OF AMERICA TO ENGAGE IN IT’S INVASION OF EAST TIMOR, America had a fear that East Timor would turn into a communist state and so they had no problems at all with Indonesia’s invasion of the land, oh yes ladies and gents, this is such a grand religious conflict isn’t it? And just incase some are wondering, the Americans didn’t merely give the Indonesians moral and political support, they actually provided the Indonesians with weapons! Virtually most of the weaponry used by the Indonesians against East Timor was American supplied weaponry!
Here is an article that goes in depth about how America supported the Indonesian invasion of East Timor:
http://www.mega.nu/ampp/nunestimor.html
All of this just serves to show how little David Wood and his friends know about the world of political affairs, will David Wood follow his own methodology now and say that a world without America would be a peaceful place too as America was directly complicit in the war on East Timor? Something tells me no, something tells me I’m going to hear more excuses, but Wood can make all the excuses he wants, facts are facts, America was a major player in the conflict AGAINST East Timor and on the side of Indonesia, all the excuses in the world will not erase that.
The Conflict in Yugoslavia
To even try and simplify the Yugoslav wars as simply being down to Islam and Muslims VS None Muslims is the peak of ignorance when it comes to examining world affairs and conflicts.
For instance if the Yugoslav wars were simply down to Islam and Muslims, then why did this major war involve conflicts between Croats and the Serbs? The Croats are not Muslims; the Croats are mainly Catholics with a minority of Muslims and Protestants. So what happened? Why did the Croat Christians face the Serbian Christians if this was a conflict down to Muslims and Islam? Let us once again throw Wood’s methodology back on him, without Christianity there would be no conflict in Yugoslavia such as between the Croats and Serbs. Now off course that sounds absurd, but when it comes to Muslims, if a person involved in a conflict happens to be a Muslim, then this means that Muslims are the problem and if their removed out of the equation then peace will happen. Sadly for Wood (again) this analysis falls flat on it’s face as Christian Serbs faced Christian Croats and both committed war crimes against the other.
Anyone who bothered to do an honest study of the Yugoslav wars will learn the conflict was mainly down to ethnic conflicts, which is why you had Serbs VS Croats, Serbs VS Bosnians etc.
The Caucus War:
Another conflict listed is the conflict between the Chechens and the Russians; this is where history conveniently evades the minds of both David Wood and the man in the video. The Caucus lands which are now part of Russia (North Caucus lands) such as Chechnya and Dagestan WERE NEVER ORIGINALLY PART OF RUSSIA, these people are not ethnic Russians. The only reason why these Caucus people are now part of Russia in the first place is because Russia invaded these territories in the 19th century, the conflict known as the Caucus wars, Russians invaded these lands and people and then annexed them into Russia. I don’t believe Wood ignored this on purpose; I truly believe HE SIMPLY DIDN’T KNOW ABOUT THIS and never bothered to check this out.
Conclusion
There’s no need to address all the other conflicts mentioned as these three examples are enough to show that the person in the video has no idea on what he’s talking about, and that Wood also needs to do a better and more honest analysis and examination of world affairs.
so if i am reading this right there are no religious tension in Indonesia ?? so lets take a glimpse into the life of non-Muslims under Islamic oppression” and references-definitions of the hateful teaching in the Qur’an.According to the Spanish daily, “La Razonthe Muslim extremist groups and local governments closed 110 churches in Indonesia. and ur saying christians arnt being persecuted,,,
Jun 3, 2008 (CNA).- Muslim extremists who are members of the Islamic Defenders Front recently attacked 200 Christians who protested for religious freedom in the Indonesian capital, threatening the protestors with death and attacking them with machetes and sticks. Twelve people were left wounded as the extremists shouted, “Repent or die.
lets not forget the 3 Schoolgirls beheaded in grisly Indonesian attack
FACT: CHRISTIANS ARE PERSECUTED IN INDONESIA JUSY ASK AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL
muslims are at war with the jews in israel
muslims are at war with the hidus/sikhs in kashmire
muslims are at war with christians in africa
muslims are at war with the buddhists in thailand
5 majour religions in total
im sure u will find an excuse for each of theses countrys and as usuall blame it on the other side
or is it all just a jewish zionist conspiracy ??
funny how you divert attention from the main point I was responding to, which was the Indonesia East Timor conflict, the fact you didn’t touch on it says it all.
As for conflict in Indonesia, yes, there have been cases of tension between Muslims and Christians, but it’s not the norm, and there continues to be a very large Christian presence within the country who are living their lives.
As for Israel, please my friend, keep your ignorance to yourself rather than trying to infect others with it…If you had bothered to do your homework you would learn that Christians too have been fighting against Israel, just to name one example, George Habbash. Furthermore, the reason why there is a conflict there is because Zionist Jews came to the land, stole it, and kicked people out of their homes, Zionist Christians as yourself can talk none stop garbage but it won’t hide the facts, that Israel, the Zionists are the aggressors and occupiers, and only in the mind of an imperial terrorist does the occupier become the victim, so you can play that game all you want, but too bad for you truth and facts are not on your side so move along.
You say I will find excuses, no, you are the one who wants to try to hide the reasons for these conflicts because you don’t like people exposing the truth, so these are not excuses as you say, but facts which you want to keep secret from everybody else, for example in Thailand where the Muslims are not given their full rights, another fact you want to hide from the people, or facts like in Central Nigeria where the Christian rulership doesn’t offer full political and citizen rights to the Muslim population, another fact you want to keep secret. But it doesn’t matter what garbage you utter, the truth is truth and it’s out there.
And just to corner you, I want you to respond to every point I just mentioned, because if you don’t, then don’t bother typing anything, comprende? Either RESPOND DIRECTLY TO THE POINTS I MAKE, or don’t waste my time with your stupid propaganda because it shall not work here, I have no time for propagandists who simply babble on when someone is making a point and the person simply ignores the points and babbles.
so you are proven my point no mater were trouble is in the world were it concerns muslims you get some one like yourself making excuses for islamic terorism instead off coming out and condeming theses people for darkening your so called religion off peace
point 1) reguarding israel that land has been occupied so many times by different empires and religions,.it is the most fort over peace off land in the world..it is christinitys most holyest place and also the jews most holyest place and your 3rd most holyest spot
but you claim it for yourselfs even tho your most holyest spot is saudia doesnt seem fair really
i could easly quote from jewish websites or christian sites reguarding the right off the jews to control israel i have plenty off websites i can give u and you can argue with them if u wish which im sure you do
israel belongs to the jews this is a fact that wont be changed it was agreed in 1948.. and i doubt the muslims would give 1 inch off that land back if you would off won any off the wars since 1948 were israel has given land for peace
(wat a waste off time that was they should of kept it)
point 2)
thailand really ?? have you seen the violence there its gettin worse but again you blame everyone else and make excuses for islamic violence in yet anougther country.. as far as i can see religious freedom is given to you in fact there even talking about extending sharia law ..you have ur own schools as well
i wonder if you will extend the same curtsy and allow buddhist schools in, saudia,yemen,oman,iran,pakistan and a few more
from what i can see muslims are the majority in nigeria,, i suppose you support boko haram (nigerias islamic terrioist group) and again you prove my point by blaming the christians in nigeria,, its evereyones elses fault but yours what a surprise,
HERE IS A FACT FOR YOU ABOUT NIGERIA
In Northern Nigeria- especially in the Muslim majority states- religious minorities are systematically marginalized and disadvantaged. And this has become more pronounced since the adoption of sharia law. In fact the state implementation of sharia has legalized the discrimination against minority religious and belief communities. Those who belong to non-Islamic faiths do not enjoy equal rights to life, security of persons, worship, association, freedom of thought and expression, etc with their Muslim counterparts. They are forced to practice their faith or beliefs in private, and to live publicly in line with Islamic norms. Politically members of religious minorities can vote but they cannot be voted for (INTRESTING WONT U AGREE ). They are made to live in a state of political subjugation and second-class citizenship
you go on about the plight of muslims in non muslim countrys but will you recognise the persecution off religious minoritys in islamic countrys ??
1) in christian countrys in the west we allow you to live under the same law as us so we are equal
2) you are allowed to practice your religion freely and you can distribute ur islamic literature and convert who ever you wish
3) you can even go door knocking like jehovah witness i never heard off you doing that but your allowed and you have sum massive mosques in europe the biggest one is across the road from the vatican which im quite sure the pope helped with that,, and wen the vatican tried to get a church in saudia the goverment just laughed at them
there excuse was that if the vatican is willing to build a moque in side the vatican then saudia would build a church in side saudia arabia sum shopping malls and football stadiums are bigger than the vatican what a pathetic statement from audia arabia
since you talk about so called muslim perecution will u tell me are christians and other faiths allowed to do any off the statements i mentioned above ??
people shud have the right to chose there own religion without being persecuted they shud also have the right to teach there religion in what ever country they wish without being persecuted ( including islamic countrys) would that not be fair ??
so you basically have no substantial reply to any of what i said.
as i expected really.
Let’s not forget the three Indonesian Christian girls that were beheaded, true, and let’s also not forget the thousands of Palestinian Muslims, women and children, who were murdered by the hands of Terrorist Christian Militia members in Lebanon’s Sabra and Shatilla. I mean please don’t let me expose and school you on the major amount of violence and terrorism committed by Christians, just look at Bosnia where we saw the worst massacres and genocide in Europe since WW2 committed at the hands of Christian Serbs against Bosnian Muslims, or will you argue that that’s all a conspiracy and made up?
Or even worse, the massacres and genocide committed by Christians in Rwanda, the worst in history since ww2 PERIOD.
My friend, your little ignorance isn’t going to work here, maybe amongst your cronies you can get away with talking rubbish, but with people who study politics, and world affairs you won’t get far at all.
im sorry you asked me to comment on israel so i did
you spoke about nigeria and thailand i commented that as well i did find nigeria intresting especially the part about the christians being persecuted
and i asked u to give me a simple yes no answer on my question,, in which you refused to answer hmmmm
your not very good at political affairs are you ?? bringing up nigeria wat a silly boy you are
i will take my research off the united nations and amnesty international thankyou not islamic propagander so move along.
so you keep supporting al-queda, hezbollah, hamas and all the other genocidal terriost organasations while trying to convince people like myself that islam is a religion of peace
You didn’t reply at all to the points I made about Nigeria and how Christians deny Muslims their political and legal rights in central Nigeria, you ignored them, you silly douche, so stop pretending like you know what your talking about, when it comes to political affairs, your the equivalent of an amazon tribal villager trying to explain quantum mechanics.
So you keep supporting terrorist imperial powers that invade and occupy countries around the world while trying to convince people like me that your the civilised good guys when in actuality you are the worst of the worst people in human history and civilisation.
As for your pathetic reply on Israel, you didn’t respond to any of the points I made that Israel is right now occupying the land and denying people their right to freedom, you just start blabbering about oh the land’s always been occupied bla bla bla bla, haha silly typical imperialist, that doesn’t address at all the point that Zionist Jews came to the land in the 1900′s, and started forcing and kicking the Arab Muslim and Christians out of their homes over which they established their illegal state, and then they occupy the Gaza and West Bank denying those people their rights of freedom and statehood, you didn’t even TOUCH on these points you silly douche. Go back to your day job of delivering pizza’s ok?
oh yes and to another point, even if you combine all the people al-qaeda, hamas, and hezbollah have killed, it doesn’t come anywhere near to what America and Israel have killed, America in dropping one nuclear bomb on Japan has killed more than all of them combined, so you see what a joke you are? you talk about other groups as genocidal terrorist movements when you have killed FAR MORE THAN ALL OF THEM, your the genocidal terrorists. you try to convince the world your peaceful while invading a country and putting military bases all over the world and in the Muslim world too, your imperialism isn’t fooling anybody.
ok mate i ansered your question twice and i only asked you 1 question and u didnt have the decency to answer it
so give me links to some useful sites reguarding everything you said
you said that in Thailand Muslims are not given their full rights show me please
you said that in Central Nigeria Christian rulership doesn’t offer full political and citizen rights to the Muslim population again show me please
i have been reading from jewish sites so again i ask you to show me your facts reguarding israel please
i dont believe buddhists would be given there full rights in any islamic country and when i mean full rights i mean be able to practice freely, teach and convert freely, and build there places off worship if im wrong correct me please
i already explained the sitution about the persecuted christians in the 12 states in nigeria but you only see 1 group being persecuted and not the other
FACT:
90%-95% OF ALL THE CONFLICTS ON THIS PLANET TODAY
INVOLVE MUSLIMS FIGHTING NON-MUSLIMS OR EACH OTHER!
There are many trouble spots around the world, but as a general rule, it’s easy to make an educated guess at one of the participants: Muslims vs. Jews in “Palestine,” Muslims vs. Hindus in Kashmir, Muslims vs. Christians in Africa, Muslims vs. Buddhists in Thailand, Muslims vs. Russians in the Caucasus, etc… these are facts you cant ignore but are trying to
religious minoritys in islamic countrys arnt treated equal to there muslim counter-parts and you have the cheek to talk about persecution really