by Sadat bin Anwar, MDI Canada
The controversy in Toronto surrounding the organized/proposed debate between Imam Sheharyar Shaikh (Sunni Muslim) of the North American Muslim Foundation (NAMF) and Ansar Raza, a top Qadiani (Ahmadi) missionary in Canada continues to grow. Raza (pictured above), who had been requesting Shaikh for the past four years for such a debate, is now unwilling to attend the event. The debate topic was set up unilaterally by NAMF as “Mirza Ghulam Ahmed: A Prophet or an Imposter?”
Raza has pointed out that the debate topic should have been set by mutual agreement by both parties. What is left out in his complaint, however, is the larger backdrop to the story. Raza is basically unwilling to debate anything about the person of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (whom Qadianis believe in as a prophet) in a formal setting. In other words, mutual agreement could never have been reached on this particular topic, even though Raza discusses this topic (ie. the allegations against Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s personality) and other related-issues on his radio program all the time. The only topic that Raza is willing to engage in on an even-leveled formal debate is whether Prophethood is still open or not, ie. are there more Prophets to come after the Prophet Muhammad? While this topic of discussion is itself closed for the world’s 1.5 billion Muslims who believe that the Prophet Muhammad is the final Seal of the Prophets (Qur’an 33:40) , the 10 million or so mostly Pakistani Qadianis (Ahmadis) assert that Prophethood is still open and that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was in fact a Prophet. (If you have never heard of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, you should not feel bad. I assure you, most of the world’s 1.5 billion Muslims outside of Pakistan have never heard of his name either, nor have the world’s 2 billion or so Christians, which sort of doubly undermines the Mirza’s claim to be the saviour of Islam and a Punjabi spiritual reincarnation of Jesus Christ)
Raza’s logical angle on the whole situation does make some sense. He gives the analogy of a business corporation that is not hiring any new employees; what would be the purpose of such a corporation holding an employment interview? Similarly, Raza argues, there is no purpose in debating the prophetic credentials or lack thereof of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad with Muslims, since Muslims are not searching or expecting any other Prophet in the first place. What should be done, Raza would say, is a debate about Prophethood itself; is Prophethood open? (are there more Prophets on the way?)
One can see the logic from Raza’s point of view. On the other hand, one can understand the logic as well as the resulting frustration on the part of Muslims as well. Let us just suppose for a moment, we Muslims would say, that Prophethood is indeed open and there can be more Prophets after Prophet Muhammad. With that as our theoretical and working premise, does Mirza Ghulam Ahmad fulfil the credentials of a bona fide Prophet? For the sake of argument, if we were to agree that more Prophets may come after Prophet Muhammad, can we consider Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Qadiani’s character, his teachings, his demeanour, and his overall life example to be congruent and in harmony with what we would expect of a genuine reformer or saint, let alone a Prophet? This is what Muslims are very eager to discuss, and they are confident that this would be a no-contest debate and that this is why no Qadiani is willing to formally engage on this topic. Furthermore, the Muslim side also realizes that what the Qadianis are effectively saying is this: “We will not debate anything about the person and character of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad until you have first altered your aqeedah (theology) to believe in more Prophets.” In other words, a Qadiani will not debate about the person of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad until the opposite side has at least done a half-conversion to Qadianism and accepted and believed that there are future Prophets to come after Prophet Muhammad. This appears illogical and unreasonable from the Muslim point of view.
So the Muslim side has an equally if not more powerful logical angle on this situation. Let us put aside the specifics of the Imam Sheharyar-Ansar Raza debate scenario for just a moment. The question is not just whether Ansar Raza should accept the debate challenge from NAMF and participate in this specific event with Imam Sheharyar, but rather there is a larger looming question of whether Qadianis will ever engage in a full-fledged formal debate about Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s character or not. The answer appears to be no. This is akin to Muslims refusing to debate Christians, unless the Christian side first accepts monotheism, accepts Jesus as a Prophet of God, and accepts that there is a Prophet to come after Jesus. No Muslim, to date, has laid down such conditions for a debate with a Christian. There are atheists and agnostics (people who are neither expecting a Prophet from God, nor are they expecting God or gods to speak to mankind) who have changed their world view and belief system based on their study of the life of the Prophet Muhammad. I’m sure that there have also been many agnostics and atheists who have had to do no more than to read about the life of Jesus in the Bible to become converted to the Christian faith. By Raza’s logic, a Christian missionary should pass over the opportunity to discuss Jesus or to try to prove that Jesus is God if he is presented with an audience of agnostics; the agnostics should at least “half convert” by accepting theism and assert their belief in God before anything about the person of Jesus is discussed.
Keep in mind that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad himself engaged in debates with Hindus and Christians in early 20th century British India without laying down such strict pre-conditions. Mirza Ghulam Ahmad often addressed allegations against the Prophet Muhammad and the Qur’an in his writings, without insisting that the opposite side first accept the Oneness of God and the possibility of a coming Prophet and Book.
In my opinion, Raza’s complaint about the debate topic being set unilaterally by NAMF has some merit on the surface, but the surrounding controversy and back-and-forths have revealed a much larger problem and weak spot for Qadianis; they are simply not willing to debate and defend the personality and character of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad in a formal, full-fledged debate setting, whether this time, or any other time. End of story. Rightly or wrongly, this only adds to the Muslim perception that such a debate would turn out to be a complete failure for the Qadiani side. It also begs the question: If Qadianis themselves appear to lack confidence in the prophetic credentials, personal character, and accomplishments of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, why should Muslims bother to give him the time of day? Can we be blamed for never having heard of his name or of his supposedly revolutionary writings?
Aside from the issue of the contentious topic, the other reasons that Raza has cited in a recently released Urdu-language video on YouTube are petty and lame, if not disingenuous. He mentions that Pastor Neil Bulloch, who was appointed the moderator for the Sheharyar Shaikh-Tarek Fatah debate in 2011, complained about the security arrangements for the debate and this is in part why Tarek Fatah did not show up. Raza must have gotten his facts mixed up. Out of the various, often conflicting reasons that Fatah gave for not showing up, Neil Bulloch complaining about security arrangements was not one of them, to my knowledge. Bulloch, like everyone else, was present in the NAMF hall that evening on January 21, 2011, waiting for and expecting Tarek Fatah to show up. To cite Fatah and his allegations against NAMF as a reason for not attending this debate is to rely on a discredited, weak crutch. Raza should mention, or perhaps he has mentioned elsewhere, that Qadiani missionaries have even entered the NAMF mosque on at least two occasions and actually engaged in (informal) dialogue with Imam Sheharyar.
Raza also questions the personal credibility and integrity of Imam Sheharyar by alleging that he hacked his (Raza’s) email account. Unless Raza is himself a master counter-hacker, we are not sure how he arrived at the conclusion that it was Imam Sheharyar or NAMF who did this. This one allegation against Imam Sheharyar/NAMF by Raza, in our opinion, undermines all of Raza’s attempts at gentlemanly one upmanship, and it is hardly to be expected of someone who purports to be a believer in the Qur’an and a mazhabi (religious) person.
O you who believe! Avoid most of suspicion, for surely suspicion in some cases is a sin. (Qur’an 49:12)
Another rather hollow complaint is that the flyer for the event promotes “hate speech”, because it uses the word “imposter” on it. A person of Raza’s calibre should have noted that the advertisement uses the word “Prophet” as well. That is the proposed debate, afterall: “Mirza Ghulam Ahmad: Prophet or Imposter?”
As mentioned near the beginning of this article, the majority of the world’s Muslims (and Christians) have not even heard of the name of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. The names of Joseph Smith (Mormon prophet), Ellen White (7th-Day Adventist prophet), Baha-ullah, and Sai Baba are far more well-known. If I was a Qadiani missionary myself, I would want to jump at this rare opportunity to be able to enter a Muslim mosque and to give my sales pitch for Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. A good salesperson is able to sell a product, against the odds. My home is full of products that I don’t want or need. If the product is presented right or its attractive qualities are highlighted in the right way, it will at least beg attention and some consideration. At the moment, most Arabs, Iranians, Somalis, Chinese Muslims, etc., have never even heard of the name of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. Qadianis really have a long way to go in this regard, and beggars should not be choosers. If the Imam Mahdi and Nabi `Isa (Jesus) of the Muslims really has come back in the person of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and is now buried in Punjab, India, don’t the Somali, Turkish, and Russian Muslims deserve to know of this? Or is it that, on some subconscious level, the Qadianis themselves realize the unsaleability of their views outside of 20th century Indian Punjab and some isolated villages in West Africa?
We hope that the situation in Toronto will be something of a wake-up call for the western-educated Qadiani youth, both in North America as well as the U.K., where the movement is (rather appropriately) headquartered. Will they really find it convincing as to why Raza is not willing to debate Imam Sheharyar? Or will they see the larger backdrop and recognize that Raza’s turnabout is part of a larger effort and strategy on their organization’s part to avoid any and all debates about the personal character of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad? Admittedly, the Qadiani youth are not given much air to breathe or think about such issues, especially those views that might be critical to their Jamaat (organization/movement) and its workings. It is a fact that most of their youth are discouraged from even informal exchanges with Muslims unless one of their murabbis (missionary tutors) is present for the occasion. They should not, for example, ever be in a Muslim mosque by themselves, lest they be swayed by normative Islam and its teachings. What’s worse, now one of their top missionaries and trainers, Ansar Raza, is himself unwilling to sit in the hot seat and discuss and debate the very issue that has divided Muslims and Qadianis for the past 100 years.
Old Urdu-language debates and mubaahilas (prayer duels), the details of which are buried in pre-Partition Urdu newspapers, are of no benefit to either the Muslim or the Qadiani youth in the West today. The debate proposed by NAMF, in the English language and easily accessible to the English-speaking audience worldwide, is much needed at this time. In the absence of Mr. Ansar Raza attending, we can probably expect an informative lecture by Imam Sheharyar Shaikh on the topic. In any event, we hope that the Qadiani youth will have an open mind and turn up anyway, even if their elders and murabbis work hard to convince them that they should not. We hope and pray that none of us will be from among the people who are described in the Qur’anic verse below:
“And when it is said to them, ‘Follow that which Allah has sent down,’ they say, ‘No, we will follow that which we found our fathers believing and doing.’ What! Even if their fathers had no sense at all and no guidance?!” (Qur’an 2:170)
Categories: Ahmadiyya, MDI Canada
The Muslim Debate Initiative 
Very well written Article. Ansar Raza; sweet talking liar….”meri email hack kur lee”. This is a joke, he is a joke.
This guy has chickened out in a worse way than Tarik Fatah did. Another win for NAMF and Imam Sheharyar. I have been watching Qadiyaani TV online and these guys trick and lie to people like no other group I have known to date. Its so easy to see their lies and questions they receive by their so called “callers”.
Do you, anyone from NAMF or Imam Sheikh have the answer to these questions?…
http://thedebateinitiative.com/2013/01/13/why-ansar-raza-or-any-other-qadiani-missionary-will-not-debate-the-character-of-mirza-ghulam-ahmad/#comment-5641
Quote:
Let us just suppose for a moment, we Muslims would say, that Prophethood is indeed open and there can be more Prophets after Prophet Muhammad. With that as our theoretical and working premise, does Mirza Ghulam Ahmad fulfil the credentials of a bona fide Prophet?
Again this would be a waste of time. Why suppose? Why not sort out your supposition first? If you prove prophethood has ended then Ahmadiyyat has no ground to stand on.
Secondly, why doesn’t sheryar Sahib sit down and and discuss with Ansar Raza Sahib? Why enforce your debate topic on others? So illogical and makes no sense and uncivilized.
“Again this would be a waste of time. Why suppose? Why not sort out your supposition first? If you prove prophethood has ended then Ahmadiyyat has no ground to stand on.”
And conversely if you can prove that prophethood did NOT end with Rasulallah s.a.w you still have not convinced anyone to become Ahmadi, because then the candidacy is left open to a number of claimants, Musaylimah, Bahaullah Irani, Ellen White, Joseph Smith and Elijah Muhammad among them. Why could they not be prophets? Why only MGA?
So you see the crux of the matter here, if you are trying to convince us that Ahmadiyyat is true that is, is to prove MGA is a prophet, and this is a topic your best missionaries are scared witless to touch and have avoided like the Bubonic Plague for over a century. They don’t even want to go there, and (hopefully I am wrong) they never will.
It still makes far more sense to debate if prophethood has ended or not first.
If we debate whether prophethood has ended or not. The outcome is either it has ended (in which there is no need for further debates) or not (then comes the question whether Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is a Prophet).
If we debate whether Hadrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) us a Prophet or not, then the outcome is either he doesn’t fulfill the criteria (in which case we lost the debate) or he does (in which case the debate went pointless as non Ahmadi Muslims insist that there cannot be any Prophets anymore). In either case there is no standing for Ahmadiyya side.
It’s a bit like discussing something which will inevitably be untrue which ever way you go. Trying to drink water from an empty bucket!
“If we debate whether Hadrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) us a Prophet or not, then the outcome is either he doesn’t fulfill the criteria (in which case we lost the debate) or he does (in which case the debate went pointless as non Ahmadi Muslims insist that there cannot be any Prophets anymore)”
If the first scenario comes true then your first proposed debate on finality of prophethood would have been a needless waste of time – we got to point B without going through point A. If the second scenario comes true then the we would all accept MGA as a true prophet and a discussion on the finality of prophethood would have been moot (we would accept your interpretations of the Qur’anic verses and Hadiths pertaining to finality of prophethood), and that would also make your first proposed debate unnecessary as well because you would still have achieved your aim of getting to point B without going through point A.
Hence it still boils down to this – the main thing that needs to be discussed is point B, the validity of MGA’s claims, his character, personality, etc.
We constantly get challenged by Christians, Atheists, Secular Humanists, etc to prove the validity of the prophethood of Sayyidina Muhammad s.a.w and Muslims have heart-warmingly responded to the challenge. Just flip through the various interfaith debates on stage, Youtube, Paltalk, and this blog itself besides other ones and you will see.
The fact that you are shying away from defending your self-proclaimed prophet speaks volumes for your credibility in the public eye and, more importantly, for your own lack of credibility in MGA.
I don’t want to argue back and forth and go around in circles – I think I have made my point – but I do want to stress one thing: Considering you, and the rest of the Ahmadiyya jamaat, are so reluctant to come forth and defend the character of your founder, just ponder on whether you’re making a wise decision or not in believing in this person. After all death can come to you any time and when it does there will be no time to repent.
You Ahmadis and us Muslims are both marching towards death. The difference is that we are going there with full confidence in the words and mission of our beloved Nabi s.a.w while you , on the other hand, don’t seem so confident. If you were you wouldn’t shy away from defending him.
Don’t let your ego respond. Just think carefully about what I’m saying.
“Secondly, why doesn’t sheryar Sahib sit down and and discuss with Ansar Raza Sahib?”
Why, so Raza’s humiliation is made private rather than public? Not a chance pal.
It’s no wonder this “humble servant of the Ahmediyya community” is so desperate on having a private dialogue with Shahryar. He knows that once he starts debating the personality of MGA he will be like a rat caught in a trap and doesn’t want people witnessing the spectacle.
Ok so sheryar Sahib solely decides on the debate topic with no discussion with the opposing side. Then says that there will be no contact until the debate. To a sensible person that seems rather an uncivilized approach to a debate and quite a condemnable attitude.
Then comes the name and shame game by sheryar Sahib, which will inevitably be that Ahmadis shy away from a so called debate.
A debate is by definition a discussion on a mutually agreed topic, which clearly not the case here.
I’m sure, if you are so worried about private/public issue I’m sure Raza Sahib wouldnt mind to discuss the topic for debate in a room under recording. But I doubt the honesty of sheryar Sahib to come and openly/privately discuss a topic for debate in a respectful and friendly manner.
mirza ghulam the outcast alleged that he was metaphorical son of God.
The Quran refutes some jewish groups who claimed that Ezra was metaphorical son of God.
so regardless whether mirza claimed to be son of God metaphorically or not, both claims are shirk.
The dajjal mirza ghulam qadiani (who died a disgraceful death) alleged that he is mentioned in the Quran [gift for nadwah page 16] also the heretic mirza alleged that qadiani si mentioned in the Quran [tadhkira page 95]
Mirza made many prophecies and used abusive words. sometimes people get whispers from Shaytaan who misguides those who are not steadfast. (Teechee Teechee, the cheeky make-believe “angel” of Mirza, might well have been a jinn.)
Amongst Mirza’s prophecies were many death threats. Despite the best efforts of qadiyani apologists and their contorted attempts at qualification and equivocation, these have for the most part been debunked as the failed rants of a charlatan.
in April 1907, Mirza Ghulam qadiani issued an open letter addressed to
Maulvee Sanaaullaah. The imposter mirza wrote (partial translation);
“…. if, during my lifetime, you are not afflicted with such punishment such as plague,
cholera etc., then I am not from God Almighty.
O God, If this claim of being the Promised Messiah is just a fabrication from my self and, in your view, I am a mischief-monger and a liar and am engaged in making false imputations day and night then, O my beloved Master, I pray to You to make me perish in the lifetime of Mr. Maulvee Sanaaullaah and make him and his group happy by my death. Aameen. But O my Perfect and True God, if Maulvee Sanaaullaah is not true in the accusations that he levels at me, then I humbly pray to You to perish him in my lifetime.” [The Last Decision with Mr. Maulvee Sanaaullaah]
this supplication made by mirza has nothing to do with a comparison or a duel between Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and Maulvee Sanaaullaah; it has to do with whether or not
Mirza was a liar.
the letter also declares that if Maulvee Sanaaullaah is not afflicted with a fatal disease in Mirza Ghulam’s life then Mirza Ghulam qadiani is not from God.
the outcome; the cursed impsoter Mirza Ghulam qadiani died a disgraceful death deficating and vomiting after about one year from the date of the letter, in 1908. However Maulvee Sanaaullaah lived for many years after him.
No wonder The Quran states; “And say, “Truth has come, and falsehood has departed. Indeed is falsehood, [by nature], ever bound to depart.” [Quran 17:81]
To refute the qadiani’s bizarre explanation regarding this confrontation;
Events preceding the “Last Decision” open letter are irrelevant. This is because Mirza Ghulam qadiani prayed to God, in the “Last Decision” open letter published in 1907, that if his claim of being the Promised Messiah is false, he should die in the life time of Maulvee Sanaaullaah.
Mirza Ghulam qadiani died before Maulvee Sanaaullaah. So mirza according to his own letter failed and was proven as an imposter according to his own writings. The events before the letter are irrelevant.
In fact, if Mirza Ghulam qadiani had referred to the letter as a mubaahilah challenge, he would have been guilty of breach of promise. That is because in 1899 the apostate Mirza Ghulam qadiani had to sign a declaration, by judicial order, to refrain from using derogatory/vile language and from any prayer dual.
On February 24th, 1899, in the court of the Deputy Commissioner in Gurdaspur, once friends and now enemies Mirza Ghulam qadiani and Maulvi Batalvi were ordered not to use foul or abusive language, or to make takfeer, or make death threats against one other, nor write each other’s names in a derogatory way.
how can a Prophet or even a saint use foul and abusive language?
clearly mirza was a dajjal.
” We hope that the situation in Toronto will be something of a wake-up call for the western-educated Qadiani youth, both in North America as well as the U.K”
”
Admittedly, the Qadiani youth are not given much air to breathe or think about such issues, especially those views that might be critical to their Jamaat (organization/movement) and its workings. It is a fact that most of their youth are discouraged from even informal exchanges with Muslims unless one of their murabbis (missionary tutors) is present for the occasion. They should not, for example, ever be in a Muslim mosque by themselves, lest they be swayed by normative Islam and its teachings”
Firstly I’m a well-educated Ahmadi Muslim student at a respectable university. I think if any of this was true I’d know that. The irony of this that its the youth who actively try to remove misconceptions against the Jamaat online, the audience that you seem to be targeting in this article.
Are you telling me that you have *not* been told by your elders/murabbis to bring one of them along for religious discussions with Muslims? Why is it that any time I have wanted to meet up with a Qadiani, I first have to spend a whole bunch of time convincing him that he will be safe if he meets up with me (even if the threat is real, why such a paralyzing fear of death??), and then he’ll always bring along his “murabbi”. Are you honestly telling me that this is not the case? Muslims here who have dealt with Qadianis will know the very opposite.
To a degree Ahmadis have been asked to be always cautious at certain Muslim environments particularly at universities and I think very rightly so. Considering the fact that there is an element of radicalization or promotion of it among Muslim students at Universities I think that is a very wise decision. Here is a recent article which really sums up my explaination:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/9796681/Extremists-attend-more-than-200-university-events.html
For example, have you not heard of the infamous underwear bomber who was a President of the Islamic society at UCL?
Otherwise I have been to many non-Ahmadi Muslim gatherings at Universities. Even openly discussed the stance Ahmadiyya vs non Ahmadiyya stance at University prayer rooms (at times with me being the lone Ahmadi).
Moreover your supposition that Ahmadis have to be with a murabbi at every non Ahmadi Muslim gatherings is far too much of an exaggeration and clearly impractical. Unless offcourse one lives in a box.
I’m afraid that everything you say works against you. The Sahaba were cut up, beheaded, and even boiled alive when they took the message of Islam to different parts of the world. Even if we Muslims were crazy radical lunatics, as your movement LOVES to propagate to the world (for its own purposes and gains), I still ask, why such a paralyzing fear of death?
Secondly, it works against you that you feel persecuted, rightly or wrongly. Your literature makes use of and agrees with hadiths that mention that Nabi `Isa will bring in a period of peace, tranquility, and justice *as the world has never seen before*. The earth is supposed to filled with justice. But 100 years after the advent of the one you think is Nabi `Isa, your movement is scared, persecuted, and cozying up to a non-Muslim government and the “Defender of the [Protestant Christian] Faith” (the British royal monarch) for protection and security. I thought Nabi `Isa is supposed to destroy the cross. But 100 years later, the grandson of Nabi ‘Isa (*sarcasm*) is instead relying on the Defender of the Cross for his protection and security.
Where do the contradictions and problems end for your theology?
The fact that Ahmadis are persecuted around the world is because they verbally, practically practice Islam, read the Kalima, the Quran, Salah, fast and preach the true Islam. So Ahmadis inspite of the potential persecution are very well following the sahaba. They too were forbidden to make hajj and so is the case with Ahmadis.
But there is a difference between doing all that and walking right into a well. My Islam teaches to avoid immediate situations where there is an obvious call for discord, anarchy, and persecution but try our best to seek situations where its calm, peaceful to deliver the message. Inevitably there will be situations where persecution persists but hopefully minimal.
Another irrelevant answer and response. So NAMF is not a calm place and appropriate place to deliver the message? Do you seriously believe NAMF will be “an obvious call for discord, anarchy, and persecution”? If you do I want to know what you are smoking !
Such pathetic attempt to claim that you are similar to Sahabas and such cowardness of not having the ability to debate and defend your cult-master. Even christianity of today (another false religion) has the courage to face tough questions and debate and have done so successfully many times at NAMF. However you try and twist the facts; it will always be remembered how Qadiyani’s ran from a debate.
I was not referring to NAMF. But who would “debate” a group in the face of intellectual dishonesty?
A debate which one party has no right on the topic of the debate
A debate in which one party has no right on the time of the debate
A debate in which one party has no right on the venue
A debate in which one party has no right on the format of the debate
A debate in which one party has no say on who the moderator should be
A debate which was unilaterally imposed on one party
A debate which goes astray from the Islamic principles of mutual consulation.
A debate in which the dictating party is unwilling to sit down face to face to reach on any of the agreements above
Yet on the other hand the dictating party says openly that, they openly welcome any debate on the terms of the opposing party. This is outright dishonesty. Forget the terms and conditions of the opposing party, its seems mutual consultation is a step too far for dictators.
If you call that a debate, then you might as well call dictatorship a democracy.
Ahmadis don’t need this kind of opportunity.
Another thing Ahmadis are not mostly Pakistani. You’ll find millions of Ahmadis in west and east Africa, if you ever go there. Ahmadis have already surpassed shias in many of them.
Sure, just like Christians go to African countries and bait the simple people with food and shelter. Reality is that, most of those “African” Qadyanis don’t know about Mirza , and those who later on found out, reverted back to their faiths, or better yet, Islam. Here’s an example when 30,000 Qadyanis revert to Islam in Africa http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4u-j0000M-w
That’s a cheap shot. The early converts tend to be poor people. Learn some Islamic history. African Ahmadi Muslims aren’t aware of their faith but You know that the African Ahmadis don’t know of Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmads claims….hmmm very believeable not! They would probably laugh at your claim.
Secondly, I think its very disrespectful to say that Africans are very dishonest, always on the hunt for food over anything.
Thirdly the funny things is Anti Ahmadis on one hand say that they take too much chanda from poor people and on the other hand there are like you who say poor people are given money for their faith.
@”Muslim” That’s really not a cheap shot, rather stupidity on your behalf. It’s quite clear that Qadyanis are known to lie about their faith to others , just like in Indonesia, they were able to get many people to sign the form to join Qadyani movement as people thought “Silsila Ahmediyya” is like other Sufi traditions. It’s a very well organized game the Qadyanis play. Qadyanis “do” collect a lot of chanda from their members in the EU , Americas and commonwealth countries it’s a no brainer; how does that link to deceiving poor african people into conversion? Did you even see the whole video I posted or are you too scared to look at the truth?
Finally, I never said africans are “dishonest”, but you seem to be uneducated from the Sunnah of Rasoolullah (S.A.A.W) who said “famine and starvation can lead one to disbelief”, but that’s too understandable since Qadyanis don’t lean anything from the Islamic traditions and teachings of the Prophet (SallAllahu Alayhi Wasallam)
Mr brainer, some of the largest participating countries in terms of numbers with regards to chanda are African countries. Are you suggesting that after Africans have voluntarily paid chanda they are somehow richer?
Your argument is many people in Africa are becoming Ahmadis and because they are poor people they must be being deceived. This argument doesn’t follow to even the slightest degree because first converts to Islam were poor people, some slaves, some Africans….should this mean they were being decieved?
Yes I saw the video years ago, today there are over 100,000 converts in Mali towards Islam Ahmadiyya and it is the largest sect after Sunni Islam.
The Hadith you presented doesnt imply that it is necessarily true all poor poor are disbelivers. You forget millions of millions of Muslims suffer from famine and starvation…are they now all disbelievers?
Let us be honest here. In Canada and the U.K., where I have visited Qadiani “mosques”, all I have seen are Punjabis. Okay, they may have “Canadian” and “British” citizenship, but they are Pakistani-born or their parents are from Pakistan. So when a Qadiani says, “Oh, we have a lot of American Ahmadiyya followers”, what they mean is, “There are a lot of Pakistani-Punjabi Qadianis in the U.S.”. This is the truth, even if you don’t like it.
Yes maybe in Western nations most Ahmadis tend to be Pakistanis but I wasn’t talking about the West. But my question is why does this matter? Surely you are aware that most non-Ahmadi Muslims are also from major Muslim nations. Just as Ahmadis are foreigners, the non-Ahmadi Muslims are too. And surprise surprise when non-Ahmadi Muslims say “Muslim Americans”, they too are referring to “Arab/south Asian Muslims in the U.S.” In 1500 years Islam Is still a minority in the world.
You are wrong on a number of issues. Firstly, even if most Muslims come from Muslim-majority countries, the point is, how did those countries become Muslim-majority? Most of them are non-Arab and they converted to Islam at some point in time. So Islam became dominant outside of the original tribe/area in which it originated. This is unlike Qadianism, where the majority of its adherents are descendants of Indian Punjabis who converted to this religion around 3-4 generations ago. Secondly, there are probably as many Muslims who hail from non-Muslim countries as from Muslim countries (hundreds of millions of Muslims from India, China, Russia, etc). This is a testimonial to the *true* international face of Islam. Thirdly, almost HALF of American Muslims are indigenous Afro-American Muslims (around 2-3 million) who are either converts themselves or the children of converts from the 1960s-1970s. So even in “free” America where you have all the freedom you need, you are unable to match the enormous and arguably miraculous growth of Sunni Islam. There are Sunni Muslim mosques all across the U.S. that are almost entirely Afro-American in their ethnic make-up. Don’t tell me there is even *one*– even *one*– Ahmadi “mosque” like that in New York, Chicago, Detroit, Buffalo, etc.
As for these “millions”…. I did actually make a passing reference to West African villages, if you recall. But I stick to the fact that most Qadianis are Pakistani (or children of Pakistanis) and you know that if you deny this, you are denying the firsthand knowledge and experience of a lifetime that you yourself possess. If you are going to falsify your own life experience, I don’t know what to say.
More about these “millions”…. how many “millions”, exactly, are we talking about? Are you talking about the 200 million Ahmadis that your official website said existed in the year 2004, or are you referring to the 80 million Ahmadis that your official website said existed in 2009? If we were to believe these numbers, that means that 120 million Ahmadis left your religion in the five year period between 2004 and 2009. That would make your religion the fastest decreasing religion in the world. Can you please clarify these numbers for us?
Response here:
http://cultgirlahmadiyya.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/refutation-allegations-regarding.html?m=1
Also:
http://cultgirlahmadiyya.blogspot.co.uk/2012/09/refutation-allegations-regarding.html
http://cultgirlahmadiyya.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/refutation-allegations-regarding.html
You sent me on a wild goose chase with those links. Not one of them answers my question about the numbers that were published on YOUR Ahmadiyya website in 2004 and 2009. In 2004, the site said that you had 200 million adherents. (It also mentioned that, in 2001 alone, you had 80 million converts! My math is not great, but I think that would mean that almost 1/10th of humanity converted to Qadianism in 2001!) In 2009, however, the same site said that you had 80 million converts. Assuming your website did not fudge any of the numbers, what happened to 120 million Ahmadis? Did they get killed or eaten up by Sunni Muslims?
To make matters worse, the Pew Forum research that you cited in your first link can only find 8 million Ahmadis across 13 African states. And you think that’s good news? Where are the other 72 million Ahmadis hiding then? Denmark? Germany?
Thirdly, if a religion with one member gains four more members, it has grown at a rate of 400%. Such a movement could claim to be the fastest growing religion/sect on the planet. Qadianism growing at a rate of 3% is not impressive.
Fourthly, the Christian World Encyclopedia categories “Hanafi”, “Maliki”, “Shafi’i”, etc. as “sects”. They are not sects but schools of thought. They belong to the same one sect of “Sunnism” or Ahle-Sunna. So if you take the growth of all of these schools together (you could add “Wahabism” in there too), there would be no doubt that, out of all the “Muslim” groups or groups that claim to be Muslim, Sunni Islam is by far the fastest growing. Sometimes you just have to open your eyes and take a look around you. Use your common sense. I have already given you the example of 2-3 million Afro-American Muslims in the U.S., who are either converts or the children of converts. This is a living example in your very own backyard, if you are in North America, that is.
There are Muslim websites that at times at placed Muslim world population as low as 800m, sometimes as high as 2bn. Would you take that as Christians eating up Muslims or getting killed? If such estimations can vary by 100s of millions why can’t Ahmadi estimations vary by 10s of millions? And yes Ahmadis in the developing world do not go counting up Ahmadis, heck millions of people die Africa & Asia due to starvation and you think Ahmadis have the resources to count? What a lame allegation.
Yes, I think that 8 millions Ahmadis in only 13 countries in Africa is not just good news, it is a blessing from Allah almighty.
“Thirdly, if a religion with one member gains four more members, it has grown at a rate of 400%. Such a movement could claim to be the fastest growing religion/sect on the planet. Qadianism growing at a rate of 3% is not impressive.”
Smaller sects than Ahmadiyya don’t have higher growth rate. So that argument is a flop.
“Fourthly, the Christian World Encyclopedia categories “Hanafi”, “Maliki”, “Shafi’i”, etc. as “sects”. They are not sects but schools of thought. They belong to the same one sect of “Sunnism” or Ahle-Sunna. So if you take the growth of all of these schools together (you could add “Wahabism” in there too), there would be no doubt that, out of all the “Muslim” groups or groups that claim to be Muslim, Sunni Islam is by far the fastest growing. ”
Here goes another flop. When you add the growth rates of different sects, in effect you “average” them (so the total growth rate is less than the highest of the summations).
Here is a nice summary id like to quote from the link site I gave:
“It should be noted that we never publish articles on this subject without reason to do so. The first in the series was published three days after one of the most major anti-Ahmadi sites on the web published an article claiming there are no more than 2 million Ahmadis worldwide. The second in the series was published shortly after the Jalsa, immediately after numerous anti-Ahmadi sites had claimed that the numbers of converts announced by the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community annually at the Jalsa Salana were too high. Finally, the post above was published in response to a subject raised by a non-Ahmadi Muslim commentator.
The point is that I and no other sensible Ahmadi have ever claimed that our numbers prove we are true. Whichever way you look at it, we are still a minority so that argument would be flawed. Some readers misunderstand these articles and think that is what we are trying to claim. It isn’t. We’re simply refuting the anti-Ahmadiyya propaganda that our community is going backwards, is very small, insignificant and decreasing in number. That is not true and that is all these articles point out.
What is true is that we are the fastest growing sect of the fastest growing religion and we leave it for the readers themselves to conclude what, if any, deeper meaning this fact has.”
it has been my experience with non-Ahmadi’s when we here in Ireland and when I was in Uk that they were forcing their topic on us! most Ahmadi’s know that the Promised Messiah (as) will only be abused! but that said, why are worried about number? you kept on talking about 1.5 billion Muslims !!!! yet when you break down the to the sects or madhabs you are all small in number!!!!
the fact is can a prophet come yes? or no? so sadat my question is to you can a prophet come after the holy Prophet (saw) YES OR NO? I dont want want explanations just yes or no
peace ( former Chritian now a Ahmadi Muslim alhamdulillah)
this is a lie. i live in west and i challenge you if you can give me even a ball park figure of how many qadyanies/ahmedies are living in uk. i’am giving you three chances and i gurentee you will not even come with in 25000 of the figure
…and how do numbers prove anything? Last time I remember, I could count the followers of Isa (as) 2000 years ago on my fingers.
“In other words, a Qadiani will not debate about the person of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad until the opposite side has at least done a half-conversion to Qadianism and accepted and believed that there are future Prophets to come after Prophet Muhammad.”
In that case, don’t believe in One God, because you’ll be half-Jew because they believe in ONE God. Or don’t believe in God all together otherwise you’ll be half-Hindu because even they believe in God.
This is a good article and brings to the fore what is really at play with the Ahmediyya movement – we need more of this work by other Muslim groups and organisations. The Ahmediyya movement need to step out of their cocoons and comfort zones that they hide behind and engage with the Muslim audience. Pathetic excuses such as those given in this video by Ansar Raza do not hold water, people on this MDI forum as well as across other Muslim forums are well aware of the fact that NAMF have successfully hosted numerous debates between high profile debaters such as Dr. Shabbir Ally and Dr. James White. The Christian side at least have the decency to be honest and courteous towards their hosts, rather than entertaining rumours and lies such as those generated by Tarek Fateh’s failure to show up for his debate. It is also worth mentioning that Pastor Bulloch is a well-respected mediator who has been misquoted by Raza as having complained about security at the NAMF venue – this is incorrect information being disseminated by Raza in this video discussion that’s been posted. Furthermore, Tarek Fateh’s claims about NAMF being a ‘hostile environment’ lacking security etc was not backed up by police, security, and certainly has not been raised as an issue by the numerous Christian debaters or their audiences that have been hosted by NAMF. The Raza video is surely a pathetic attempt at saving face on the part of Ahmedis in cowering out of debating an issue that they do not want to be exposed on.
“Muslim” you should do a self check on your nickname , you should know by now as ‘an educated’ Uni-attending Ahmedi that you claim to be that you cannot claim to be ‘Muslim’ by definition of what the term ‘Muslim’ represents in worldwide Muslim population. Just like in the video posted by your missionary Raza, and as with other Ahmedis you try to cover up the line that separates you from Islam and Muslims, Also, save yourself time and effort in response by claiming that you’re are Muslim or represent a sect, go back to your books and read what Mirza Gulam Ahmed calls those who fail to embrace his prophethood and the Ahemdiyya movement. You Ahmedis attempt to portray yourselves as noble people who are all embracing and brothers-in-arms with the rest of the Muslim population – iyet you go out on the streets, book venues, and run tv chanels to proselytise your own separate movement. In fact, you people refuse to pray at the same mainstream mosques and behind Muslim Imams, so start by changing your deceptive nick if you want to discuss this issue; at least have the decency to identify yourself as an Ahmedi, not a ‘Muslim’ – which you are not.
Mehreen, go get some fresh air and try to understand what you quote before attempting to rebuttal it.
Br. sadat
salam
From where you got this number of one million or so for the qadiyani population becasue there is no official prove for this much population of qadiyanis.
Although they have record of all qadiyanis BUT they never ever show it, so that people should not know that they are only few hundered thausands.
Br. Amjad,
You may be right. Some people believe that there are only hundreds of thousands of Qadianis. I was being generous to them and granting them the number 10 million. A.K. Shaikh is of the opinion that the Qadianis are probably around this number.
hmmm….see the links above. Peace.
Br. Sadat Anwar
These guys are extremely hard to have reasonable discussion with and debate on a relevant topic as we’ve learned is out of the question altogether. Every day on their channels or if you happen to talk to Qadiyaani in person they will keep quoting you some random imaginary Mullana in Pakistan who did such and such or said such and such awful thing. Then they will then step back and say, oh we are the good people as we do not do that so join us. They believe that somehow proving some imaginary Mullana wrong will make them right. It’s a cult that has no strong basis.
They are like rest of us but I feel that misinformation from their elders and extremely low belief in their own religion and obviously fabricated stories that no sane person can trust in has made them insecure which makes them resorting to lies pathologically. Their famous fabricated hadiths they keep quoting about eclipse doesn’t still work out even if you assume its authentic and they have to do gymnastic to make it work….but even then it doesn’t. So what can you expect from them, they are very connected to their cult but have no sound reason to do so. The best way for them is to not discuss and run when questioned.
As you pointed out, they can’t make up the mind about how many Qadiyaanis there are. It’s a different number for different situations. When they need to show they are minority then it’s a much lower number and when they want to invite someone in to their invented religion it’s a much larger number to show them that you are not alone. This is funny when they have detailed membership information of each Qadiyaani that attends their mosque.
Here is a strong basis for you about the very real persecution of Ahmadi Muslims…
U.S. House of Representatives Testimony: Persecution of Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in South Asia
How is self victimization speech helps answer my accusation about being pathological liars and giving different numbers of cult members depending on situation and motive. How does it answers my claim that you guys have no strong basis for your religion and the best evidence is fabricated and still illogical.
See what I am talking about….being really hard to have logical/reasonable conversation with. I speak about a and you reply with z. Like many minorities Ahmadis are sometimes victims but how is this a reply to my comments… none of this makes your religion true or rebuts my charge. I don’t think Ahamdis are dumb but the reason is that they have no solid argument or defense so they instead focus on changing subjects and focus on being victimized Instead.
Bismillah Ar Rahman Ar Raheem.
Asalaam O Alaikum wa Rahmatullah.
Here are some Important Questions for the North American Muslim Foundation (NAMF) that come to mind specifically relating to the proposed debate:
1. Was the debate topic mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
2. Was the date/time mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
3. Was the venue mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
4. Was the format of the debate mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
5. Was the moderator mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
6. Was the design and responsibility for associated costs of printing & distribution for promotional flyers approved and mutually agreed upon by BOTH parties? Yes or No? Please provide evidence that confirms.
7. Is there a signed agreement of acceptance between BOTH parties regarding the debate and associated terms so there would be no misunderstanding? Yes or no? Please provide evidence that confirms.
8. Is imposing a unilateral topic for debate without the consultation of an opponent consistent with the spirit of engaging in civilized, open and honest debate?
9. Is imposing a unilateral topic, date, time and venue consistent with the principles of Islam? What happened to the very important concepts of Mutual Consultation and reaching an agreement between parties?
10. Mr. Farooq Khan openly challenged anyone to come forth on THEIR OWN TERMS to debate and the venue would be provided by NAMF (see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv-BT5nwsu0). Has this invitation been revoked? If not, then why is Imam Shaikh avoiding mutual agreement with Mr. Raza regarding terms and instead dictating a unilateral agenda that suits him alone? Should Imam Shaikh not be welcoming ANY topic for debate with open arms in accordance with Mr. Khan’s own policy?
11. Here is what Mr. Farooq Khan has publicly said about hate mongering towards religious figures/communities:
Does Mr. Khan hold himself and those associated with NAMF and MDI accountable to the same standards?
Jazakallah and Wasalaam.
And will quadianis answer the questions posed here?….
http://www.irshad.org/info_q/questions.php
Here we go. 2 would be enough for a start.
1) http://www.alislam.org/books/truth/gospels.html
2) http://www.reviewofreligions.org/2701/the-promised-messiah%E2%80%99s-love-for-the-holy-prophet/
Others can come when you’ve read,understood those.
Let’s start with the first one.
http://www.alislam.org/books/truth/gospels.html
When you are done, having understood it come back.
Qadiyanis/Ahmadis are known for mixing truth with falsehood, this is my own personal experience. sometimes it becomes hard to catch them unless you are familiar with their tactics. NAMF may bend over backwards to accommodate them, but they will still find problems with them. Therefore, I consider Qadiyanism/Ahmadiyyat as a fitna, a fraud and a dishonest cult that has fooled its own members in believing that this is the true Islam, whereas it is not. It is a cult a family run business of Mirza clan. Now coming to Mirza Ghulam Ahmad their founder he made several false claims and prophecies and we know most of them failed and never came true. Ultimately he died in his own curse as a liar. His organization is now spreading his lies as the true Islam unfortunately and is now supported and funded by enemies of Islam such as Tarek Fatahs group. They are working hand in hand overtime to discredit Islam, Muslims and their Countries all in the name of “defending Islam.” This is a hard core conspiracy against Muslims and their Countries to take them away from Islam and replace them with the false teaching of the Mirzai cult. Ansar Raza in a recently released video on You tube accuses NAMF and other Muslims, while his organization is involved in propagating Mother of lies in the West. Here is a perfect example, Ahmadiyya claims that Mirza Ghullam Ahmad is the “Promised Messiah as foretold by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)” Whereas the truth is it was Isa a.s (Jesus Christ, pbuh) and not Mirza. The liars of Ahmadiyyat have no shame, no guilt and no courage to face the truth except attacking and blaming Muslims. Now they are running away like cowards from this debate while giving some lame excuses.
May Allah s.w.t protect us all from this fitna of Ahmadiyyat. May Allah s.w.t guide those whom he wills from the Ahmadiyya to Islam. May Allah s.w.t. help us in defending this deen from the corrupt teachings of Mirza Ghulam A. Qadiyani. May Allah s.w.t protect humanity from the filth of Ahmadiyyat which leads a person to Kufr.
Ansar Raza is giving example of an organization that is not hiring any employees and then why having interviews. My question to Ansar Raza is we have given you proof from Hadith and Quran that why there can be no more prophets to come after Muhammad (s.a.w.s) and it is crystal clear to all Muslims. But since you are the ones who are not believing in Quran and Hadith and still arguing that there will be more prophets to come. So we go to plan B and say o.k. how come you believe in such a such person (Mirza Ghulam Ahmad) as a prophet/messiah/Mahdi when his character and life was so degrading? See it is not just issue of whether prophethood is open on not. Ahmadis believe in him as Messiah and Mahdi also. All in one basically, so we want to debate his character with you to see how you consider this man to be a messiah or a madi or even a mujaddid. So it is not just an issue of Prophethood being open or closed it is more than that. But knowing that they will loose 100% Ansar Raza is running away.
I read this article. It is quite biased and favors opponents of Ahmadiyyat.
The point to note is that Namf did not discussed with Ansar raza sahib the topic date time and venue. Also set up the pattern in which the debate will occur. I have seen the email communications from Namf in which they just sent the email along with the flyer. Namf did not even bothered to ask Ansar Raza sahib will he be available in those dates and times and will the venue and topic are acceptable. In the same communication the response of Ansar raza was to discuss the topic and he gave the same analogy mentioned in the article. But Namf simply ignored his request and closed the communication by simply refusing to make any kind of changes to the program. This seems like dictatorship. A debate can only occur if agreed upon by both parties. I called Namf and spoke to Farooq Khan and asked him if Sheharyar sheikh will be able to debate on the topic suggested by Ansar Raza but he refused to Answer this. I asked this question a few time can he debate next month but his reply was I don’t know. I then asked him If Ansar Raza prints a similar flyer and sets up a topic date time and venue of his choice then will Sheharyar sheikh will debate. Surprisingly his answer was no body can dictate us. So does this mean that Namf possess the authority to dictate others but they don’t want this to happen to them. Also there is a clip on you tube where Farooq khan on occasion of debate with Tarek Fateh announce that Namf is willing to debate all others at Their Terms. Now he is totally going against his word by accepting to debate on Ansar Raza’s terms Namf is not even willing to accept any suggestions from Ansar Raza instead they just want to impose their wishes. Why not Sheharyar sheikh accept the challenge of Ansar Raza and debate by mutual agreement instead of dictating him all their suggestions.
Will someone from NAMF please provide a reply to the questions raised here and those put forth earlier in this string?
NAMF have no answer. They even know that the moderator whose name was not mentioned in the flyer has refused to come and so they have to unilaterally decide for another moderator just before the start of the debate as they often do.
Here is a video clips with some of the questions to NAMF and lets us see if NAMF or any of their representatives come up with some answers and evidences or not.
Reality of Debate imposed by NAMF (Sheharyar Sheikh) on Ansar Raza (Ahmadi Muslim)
the imposter mirza ghulam qadiani alleged
;
“You are to Me like My Unity and My Uniqueness. Therefore, the time is approaching when you will be helped and will be made wellknown
in the world. You are to Me like My Throne. You are to Me like My son”
English Online Tadhkhirah Book page.860 PDF page.880
“You are to Me like my progeny”
English Online Tadhkhirah Book page.510 PDF page.530 footnote
“You are from Me and I am from you.”
English Online Tadhkhirah Book page.400 PDF page.420
“In a vision, I saw God Almighty personified as a human being. He put His arm round my neck”
English Online Tadhkhirah Book page.609 PDF page.629
its clear that the founder of qadianism mirza ghulam of qadian contradicts even the most basic teaching of Islam (tawheed). Thus mirza ghulam qadiani was a dajjal and polythiest.
now lets see what the Quran states;
“No vision can grasp Him, but His Grasp is over all vision. He is the Most Subtle and Courteous, Well-Acquainted with all things. ” [Quran ch 6 vs 103]
Therefore God cannot be seen in a vision.
God says: “And who can be more unjust than he who invents a lie against God, or says: “I have received inspiration,” whereas he is not inspired in anything; and who says, “I will reveal the like of what God has revealed.” And if you could but see when the wrong-doers are in the agonies of death, while the angels are stretching forth their hands (saying): “Deliver your soul! This day you shall be recompensed with the torment of degradation because of what you used to utter against God other than the truth. And you used to reject His signs (revelations) with disrespect!” (Quran 6:93)
You think the article is biased because you and Anpad Raza are both Ahmadis. You do not think with neutral mind.
…and you do with your attitude?
Look at the attitude of your so called Prophet Mirza. His language is most vulgar and he called those who did not believe in him as “Children of Prostitute” What more do you have to say. If you do not like my attitude look at the attitude of your own Mirza and read his books you will be astonished at this vulgar abuses against the Mighty and noble Messenger of Allah. s.w.t and you call this man a Prophet, Maseeh Maud, and Mahdi or Mujaddid? I think only a sick person would do that.
Which sensible Muslim would believe a Muslim who finds pleasure in twisting Quranic names..emitting in abuse?
It remindes me of Islamophobes who try their level best to show attitude of our beloved Muhammad (sa) in a negative light whilst themselves being abusive. The argument ends there.
Same with you. Abusers have zero arguments.
Your Mirza himself was an abuser. So he must have had Zero arguments according to your own theory.
You Ahmadis are one of the Islamophobes out there. What are you talking about?
Mirza insulted Prophet Muhammad. s.a.w.s. and Jesus Christ pbuh. So according to your own words Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was an “Islamophobe.”
You are talking about debate with Ansar Raza? Please watch this debate and you will see that how Ansar Raza sahib is behaving like Anpad Raza. This is what happens when you follow the mentally confusing teachings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Sahib:
Watch this video. The above one is edited and censored version. This is the original uncensored debate from start to end.
Ansar Raza Debated with Akbar Chaudhry – Un-Sensored – Un-Edited
Also see how your scholar Akbar Chaudhry behaves in this video clip which he censored.
Akbar Chaudhry says Nabuwat is not blessing of Allah Vs Ansar Raza says Nabuwat is blessing of Allah
Hope the above clips will help you.
Looks like this Ahmadi supporter of Anpad Raza is also Anpad. First he says watch this uncensored video and this is not even a video. My answer to both Anpads (not enough educated) is that half knowledge is dangerous and this is why you lost and strayed away from the truth. Can anyone defend a liar and foul mouthed person with contradictory teachings like Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. I would say yes only if you are a like minded person. O Anpad Raza and your supporters have you no shame or fear of Allah s.w.t that you place with the deen of Allah s.w.t and his Messenger s.a.w.s. You fabricate the authentic teachings and quote them as if it was told by Allah s.w.t. in other words you attribute lies to Allah s.w.t. what kind of humans would do that????
It’s a shame you manipulate such a beautiful Quranic name, abusing in the process.
Your argument (if any – though you don’t have any) becomes void.
I have no intention of abusing the Quranic Word. i am trying to comment on the person i.e. Ansar Raza who is actually abusing the word of GOD almighty by adding his own dubious interpreations. Still you don’t get it?
For those in areas where youtube is banned.
Salam aleilum wr wb,
Ansar Raza sb. has debated couple of maulvies and i’ve seen and heard the arguments of those maulvies. It’s always the same: when they have no answers anymore, they come up with baseless arguments.
Now, Mr. Sheheryar have -I guess- also seen the debates of Mr. Raza sb. so he should have recognized the standards Mr. Raza implemented in his discussion.
At first there was this Akbar story … Mr. Raza asked to show via Qur’an if there is any evidence from where one can see that there will be no more Prophets after Muhammd saw.
After a long time Mr. Akbar didn’t come with any evidence, but just typical allegations regarding Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad as. Irrelevant and baseless informations.
Than recently there was this other Mullah on skype who forgot turning off his mikrophone. Just like Akbar … Not a single proof … Ansar sb. was matchless.
Now Sheheryaar thought “Oh man .. Those big caterpillars couldnt destroy the Ahmadiyya Building, I’ll come with my atillerie and will destroy his Prophet” …
His self proclaimed, self dictated “Debate” insisted Mr.Raza to come and “fight” … The problem of this whole issue is, that this is no “Ready to Rumble” fight. Deen has become for these ppl a game where the other has to lose after a verbal fight.
What would happen, if Mr. Raza came?
1. Baseless accusations on the humble servant of Muhammad saw. i.e. Ahmad as.
2. Mr. Raza would’ve refuted them
3. But there would still be one question:
CAN PROPHETS COME YES OR NO.
So, why are you acting like someone who failed in his exam but still asking the prof “but i had not the time to learn” which is irrelevant, relevant is to proof the professor wrong on the basic topic.
So, proof Mr. Raza wrong on THE BASIC TOPIC which is
CAN PROPHETS COME, YES OR NO.
wassalam
Shame on you for accusing Akbar Chaudhary sahib and sarcastically naming other scholars as mullahs, while protecting your own cult members. You do not practice what you preach? Akbar debated honestly and asked Ansar Raza to provide the proof that more prophets will come as it is his own interpretation and nothing to do with teachings of Islam. Ansar Raza failed to provide proof. Whereas Akbar Sahib overcame in the end by providing abundance of express statements in Quran and Hadith to provide the end of Prophethood with the advent of last and final Messenger of Allah s.w.t. Muhammad s.a.w.s. When truth comes falsehood disappears and Ahmadiyyat is based on mostly falsehood.
Just to show you the history:
1. Akbar sb.
2. Bhatti sb.
now Shaikh sb.
Here is what Imam Shaikh and NAMF objected to:
Full Coverage of Muhammad (saw): The Astonishing Story of the Prophet (Free event which was held on November 20th, 2012, Roy Thomson Hall, Toronto, Canada) hosted by volunteers from the Ahmadiyya Muslim Jamaat
Here is what guests who came from a diverse range of backgrounds had to say about the event honoring the beautiful life of our beloved Holy Prophet, Muhammad (saw):
Instead of joining forces to help honor the life of the Holy Prophet (saw), Imam Shaikh boycotted the event and instead launched a unilateral debate campaign directed at Jamaat Ahmadiyya.
Reasonable minds will ask Imam Shaikh why he advised his followers against attending the event (especially in an open and free society) which was held solely for the purpose of honoring the life of The Holy Prophet (saw) of Islam and was well attended by a diverse range of people. Where was Imam Shaikh when Muslims (from different sects) and even non-Muslims attended the event to show their interest and support in the life of the Holy Prophet (saw) of Islam?
Look at what Mr. Farooq Khan from NAMF has publicly said (Imam Shaikh was present) about respecting other religious leaders/communities:
In his article (http://thedebateinitiative.com/2012/11/21/ahmediyya-and-muslims/) and by his actions, has Imam Shaikh lived up to these high standards given the language, tone and types of accusations he has raised towards another Islamic community?
Shame, shame and shame on you Ahmadiyya cult missionaries for your hypocracy and double standards. You prevent your own youths from mingling and learning from Muslims. You do not allow your members to listen to Muslim Scholars. You do not allow your folks to marry a Muslim. You do not allow your members to go to legal courts except your dubious Qaza board. You do not allow your members to pray behind Muslims. You arrange interfaith dialogues and claim you are representing Muslims (you liars). You call your cult leader as Khalifa of all Muslims (you liars). You call Mirza as promised messiah as foretold by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) mother of lies, and you have the audacity to ask why Muslims do not attend your self arranged (GOD knows what motive it was) functions???????
According to your leader Mr. Farooq Khan (NAMF) you are committing a punishable crime. According to him a person like you should be punished because of spreading hate and because of using abusive language against Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani (AS) the founder of Ahmadiyya Movement. Look at your own double standards and then talk. Just watch the video above either Mr Farooq is correct and your are committing a punishable crime or he was just lying in public. Obviously one of them is correct.
Did you not read this article by Imam Sheikh (http://thedebateinitiative.com/2012/11/21/ahmediyya-and-muslims/) where in a free country he openly tried to limit his followers from attending a free public presentation on the Life of the beloved Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw)? Did you watch the presentation and interviews? To what part do you object?
Mr. “a” If you want to punish people for so called committing hate and using abusive language then your Mirza was the top candidate. He spread hatred against Muslims who did not believe in him, cursed them by writing lanat 1000 times in his books and abused them by calling them “Children of Prostitutes”. He also abused the personality of Hazrat Isa a.s. Jesus Christ peace be upon him in such derogatory words that no Muslim has done this so far. So please punish your founder first before pointing at others. Instead of rejecting him you are telling others to blindly follow him. We are just trying to open your eyes to his abusive language and a character which was quite debatable (proven to be a liar according to his own words). We do not hate anyone. We are tying to protect our religion from corrupt teachings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. We also care that if we did not pass our message to ignorant Ahmadis about the false teachings of Ahmadiyyat we will be held accountable on the day of judgement for not doing our job. But because you accuse us and argue with us on baseless arguments and self made theories to suit your own agenda, it becomes irritating. If you think someone is hating you, you are wrong. If you thing someone is abusing your Mirza you are again wrong. We are just portraying his true character. Many Ahmadis like you used to thing this way, but when they did their own research they realized that how they were mislead by the Dajjal Mirza. By the way in authentic hadith it is mentioned that Dajjal will not enter Mecca or Medina and this Mirza Dajjal never entered these places. We can give abundance of evidence that he was not a Prophet, Messiah or Mahdi but your mind is shut to this truth and you are blindly following him. Beware on the day of Judgement no one will help you you alone have to face our Lord and be answerable to your actions.
@ Peace
Who mentioned that Mirza Sahib has written Laanat 1000 times but you did not mentioned the story behind or the Mullah who told you that Mirza Sahib has written the word Laanat 1000 times but for who?
this video will tell the complete story. Just like a group of people has made a movie against Holy Prophet SAW all the muslims are sending laanat on them may be more than 1000 times and so did Mirza Sahib wrote Laanat for Padri Emaad Ud Din who wrote a book and used extremely abusive language for Holy Prophet SAW and Holy Quran. Padri Emaad Ud Din used to be a Khatib and expert of Arabic and Holy Quran but alas he converted to Christianity and started using abusive language and then wrote a book insulting Holy Prophet SAW and Holy Quran and claimed that since he was a muslim and an expert of Arabic and he knows very well about Quran and the life of Holy Prophet. Even the news paper mentioned that if another mutiny loomed then it will be just because of actions of this padri Emaad ud Din. Then Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani wrote a book “Noor ul Haq” and challanged this Padri Emaad Ud Din that since he claims to be expert in Arabic then come forward and Answer this Book and if he is not able to Answer within 3 months then may 1000 laanat be on him.
For person like padri Emaad ud Din it is mentioned in Holy Quran that Laanat be on such a person of Allah and all the malaik (angels) and all the Humans in the world, now this Laanat will be in Trillions and Trillions.
I am sure that if a person uses abusive language for Holy Prophet SAW and insults Holy Quran then all the muslims will not only sent 1000 laanat rather Billions and Billions of Lanaat for him.
Now the reality that Opponents of Ahmadiyyat will never tell why and for who Mirza Sahib wrote Laanat 1000 times. I hope this will answer your Allegation about 1000 times Lanaat.
@ Peace.
Forgot the add the video Link.
@ Peace
Regarding your Zurriyat Ul Baghaya
Here is the video that explains the details of this world and will prove that All the Mullahs who tell muslims that Mirza Sahib has called his opponents has children of prostitutes will be proved Liars. Just watch this video as the videos proves it all.
Also in this second clip, there is a question that can any Molvie answer why Mirza Sahib used this word in Arabic writings but never used it in Urdu. Did Mirza Sahib not know the meaning this word in Urdu language ?
and finally when Mirza Sahib used the same word in urdu he translated Zurriyat ul Baghiya as children of Rebellions (but Molvi translate it as children of prostitues).
see this video:
And finally see Imam Bakar has also used the same exact word but your own Molvies translate that as children of bad people but when Mirza Sahib use that word they translate as children of prostitutes. Just watch at 12:35 min. in this video:
I hope this will shed a lot of light on the word Zurriyat ul Baghiya
@ Peace
you allegation that He also abused the personality of Hazrat Isa a.s. Jesus Christ peace be upon him in such derogatory words…..
is again another Lie. During a debate with Christians when the Christians priest used abusive language for Holy Prophet SAW then Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani showed them the mirror that see what your bible says about your Jesus and he clearly mentions these are the quotes from bible to show those priests their own face and then told them that our Holy Quran tells that Jesus(as) was a prophet of God. but alas molvies hide these facts and just misguide muslims that see what Mirza Sahib says about Isa(as).
see this video and clear your doubts that Mirza Sahib never used abusive language for Jesus(as) or Isa (as).
and this as well.
and this one explains this in detail.
HOpe that this will clearly prove that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani (AS) never used abusive language for Jesus(as) or ISA(as).
If somebody wants to borrow some money from us what Is our first response? We first wants to find out about his character. After all, we want to make sure that the asking person is trustworthy or not. Here it is not a question of few dollars but of IMAN and the life after death. It is interesting Quadianis wants us to put our trust on MGA and give our Iman to MGA but don’t want us to inquire about his character. Sorry, No contributions to MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATIVE BANK from me.
There is no compulsion to believe. You are free to do as you wish. No one has compelled you to do anything.
@ Ib
Your logic is absolutely wrong. I a person holds a firm belief that there is no prophet after Holy Prophet SAW then even If our Murrabi Sahibaan spends hours and hours and prove that Mirza Sahib bears good character but that person will surely say that no doubt Mirza Sahib is very good but he cannot be a prophet since there is no prophet After Holy Prophet SAW.
so Logic starts from can a prophet come after Holy Prophet SAW or not. If proved not then end of discussion. There is no point to see If Mirza Sahib is a prophet or not as prophet cannot come. But if proved that a prophet can come then we need to see who can that be whether it will be the same Jesus(as) that came to Jews or some one else …
The problem with your argument is that you can’t defend somebody who is not defendable and MGA false in such category. ” MGA and very good!” It is oxymoron.
Are you kidding me or what? Of course not. And even if somebody does it, it is not going to happen. But Few months ago near the end of his radio program Ansar Raza was asking his listeners to turn to Quadianism suggesting that since prophet Isa and Menhdi has already arrived in the form of MGA, what non quadiani listeners are waiting for? So you want to turn muslims to Quadianis but not talk about MGA’s character. The fact is that you will never want to discuss the MGA’s character in open. Is his character so low that while you want to promote him as reincarnation of prophet Mohammed (PBUH), prophet Isha (AS) and Imam Mehndi (Astagferullah), you want to keep your mouth shut and don’t want to discuss it in open fearing it will harm interests of MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATIVE BANK? You want to have cake and eat it too. When are quadianis going to start riding on MGA’s coattails? You are promoting your goods but when we say let us talk about the factory that produced your goods, you run away saying well, no one is compelling you to buy our goods.
The posted videos from Ahmadia are recycled stuff. When MGA was asked in which Jewish or Christian book he found such a derogatory language for Jesus, he had no answer. Even his subsequent deputies did not give name of any such books. MGA was #1 liar and so are his deputies. Their whole game plan is to ensure that MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATIVE BANK keeps on flourishing at any cost and poor quadiani brothers are being deceptively sucked into their game plan.
Comprehensive evidence has been presented in the foregoing comments which shatters your baseless allegations to pieces. Funny how you refer to the truth as being “recycled stuff” because it does not suit your prejudiced, uninformed and bigoted view.
Refute the truth which has been presented if you are truthful.
I read useless stuff from Ahmadis in the comments regarding topics they can neither prove or disprove. My question is simple, how could a person with such vulgular language in his books, cursing everyone else with bad words and then continue to change his claims (Mujadid, Mahdi and then pregnant with ISA) be some prophet. The fact that Ahamdis (you guys) run away from debating him is evidence enough that you yourself don’t feel comfortable debating him and his character. And rightly so because if you did then Ahmadiyaa will be shattered to pieces in front of everyone.
There is no point of debating this topic or other topic and beating around the bush using vauge language and concepts but if you are truthful then you should come face to face with the real question, “Was Mirza Ghulam Ahmad a true prophet or an imposter?” Now if you can not face this question publically this tells a lot about your cult, your confidence and how true your claims are.
MDI and other sunni Muslim debators faces similar questions regarding our prophet and we do not run away and take It head one because we are confident. If you have claim about somebody being able to fly for example, it’s useless to dabate if sky is blue or light blue…..because it’s a waste of time. Until Ahmadiyaa is able to defend its claims it will never flourish and every Sunni living in Canada will remember you running away (soon to be repeated around the world)
When Muzaffer Ahmed of Germany quit Ahmadiyah movement, the reasons he provided are so succinct that it covers all the bases.
In his address to the Friday gathering in Tauheed Mosque, Muzaffar Ahmad Muzaffar said
“This day is a very blessed day for my whole family. We are coming out of the tortuous valleys of infedelity, cunningness and deception into the straight and lighted path of Islam. The story Qadiani conspiracies, viciousness and wickedness is spread over hundred years. For me the reasons of my conversion are as follows: Behind this decision, there are seven years of day and night reading books, personal observations, internal conduct of Jamaat, staying away of the Jamaat from the Sunnat of Holy Prophet SAAW, Jamaat’s unnatural and un-islamic attitude, innumerable pagan beliefs of the movement, Movement’s attempts to flood the literature with alterations and metaphoricals in the meanings of Holy Quran, and the decisions of Muslim Ummat in April and Sept 1974 regarding Qadianis (declaring them out of the fold of Islam). On the other hand the claims of Mirza Sahib extend from being ‘Self-Cultivated Seedling of British’ to the claim of divinity. In summary the other name for KUFR is Qadianism. Therefore I alongwith my whole family denounce all those repulsive beliefs and announce my reversion to Islam.
(Urdu Poetry: Hum aisay saada diloon kee niyaz mandee say
Butoon nay kee hein jahaan mein khudaeeyaan kiya kiya)
Because of the benevolence of simple-hearted people like us
Idols have performed many divine acts all over the world.”
Should we say anything more? May Allah guide you to the correct path.Ameen.
@ islambychoice
just because all these allegation are lies and nothing but the lies. there is not a single proof of any of these allegations when you read a few pages from the same book and the same place you find that in fact opponents of Mirza Sahib are such a big liars that is the reason why all the opponents of Mirza Sahib died with this wish in their heart to stop Ahmadiyyat from going out of Qadian but they failed and Ahmadiyyat spread to over 200 countries of the world.
Remember Lies and Liar have no ground to stand on and this is what the opponents are doing and telling lies and without any proofs.
@islambychoice
Under your theory,
What would you say about the following verse:
” Say, ‘Shall I inform you of those whose reward with Allah is worse than that? They are those whom Allah has cursed and on whom His wrath has fallen and of whom He has made apes and swine and who worship the Evil One. These indeed are in a worse plight, and farther astray from the right path.
5:60
…or you are just a Ahmadiphobe?
@Muslim Buddy, copy/pasting same and random verse from the Holy Quran regarding punishment does not support your case or argument or in any way support your dead cult-master. Your either a child or a man with child’s brain to use it as a form of rational argument and extremely stupid if you feel that is a reply back to my argument
@a….”Opponents of Mirza Sahib died with this wish in their heart”…how does you or your cult know the wishes of other peoples heart….are you God? Just because you get brain washed with stupid old tales that can not be independently verified every day on your network doesn’t make them true. This is what all cults do….make up stories to keep their members and Ahmadiyya is no exception. When pressed for reference you link videos created by you where two of your own mulvis are having stupid discussion….who come up with more lies as they go. This is called circular fallacy and your cult is famous for it
Again, I repeat…if I you had any shame, truthfulness and confidence in your vulgur and lying cult-master who you call prophet then your so called debater would have turned up…..but its quite obvious He will never debate what he knows he will sure loose and Qadiyaani members with it. And no, we don’t want to waste our time debating if the sky is black or blue….because it has no effect on anything…..so instead of beating around the bush, we want to focus on real debate…….Imposter or prophet.
@islambychoice
Bud, First you did not make an argument. You made a claim. A man with a child’s brain seems to be able to decipher that. I think that speaks well about the level of your intelligence with no further comment needed on that.
I just gave you a very relevant verse. The very same verse is used by islamophobes to (God forbid) point out vulgarity of the Quran. As their argument would be this is a description of humans and fits into the vulgarity criterion in their perception. Putting it aside by labelling it as punishment does not do justice to their claim.
@ IB
when you are answer-less and when your lies are revealed then you say recycled stuff. Well Ahmadiyyat talk with logic and proof and the opponent of Ahmadiyyat talk with lies and crockery.
Just show a single proof as who and when anybody asked Mirza Sahib to show such langauge for Jesus in bible. Just bring me a single proof from history that any body asked where as on the contrary everyone (including the top notch scholar Abul Kalaam Azaad) praised Mirza Sahib for his work and regarded him as a successful general on behalf of Muslims. Looks like your history is very weak.
see this with a proof. but you again have no proof just lies.
And How truthful MIRZA FAMILY’S CO-OPERATVE BANK Is? Here is a link to recently published Proceedings of 1974 National Assembly of Pakistan regarding Ahmadies. It is crystal clear how quadiani khalifa dances around straight questions from AG and how the liar is looking for cover.
http://files.qern.org/1974/
In the Ansar Raza authored Youtube clip titled, Qadiani Ahmadiyya KHATM-E-NABUWWAT Concept – Truth – Ansar Raza- Must watch ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyUMi5bfk-Y), he acknowledges, “It is, therefore, evident that the only difference between Ahmadi and non-Ahmadi belief is not in the concept but in the personality of the Promised Messiah.”
Surprisingly, instead of debating about the “personality of the Promised Messiah”, he was beating around the bush pleading to talk about the “concept” of Finality of Prophethood in the hope that the “personality of the Promised Messiah” is forgotten.
Last night, Shehryrar Sheikh did a great job, Maasha Allah. When his video is out on Youtube, I bet, Ansar Raza and others will not desist from responding to it, albiet in a lame way. Thereby, he will finally enter the debate, but it will be remembered that he did not have the guts to come out face to face. May Allah SWT guide the innocent Ahmadees caught in this trap. Ameen.
Ansar Raza did not run away rather this was imposed on him without consulting him. and NAMF is notorious in doing so.
First you claim that we will debate on your terms and then you impose debate and turn back on your heels and never accept any terms rather dictate the opponents
I talked to Mr. Farooq Khan before the debate and asked him Can Sheharyar sheikh be able to debate Ansar Raza after this debate maybe next month on the topic suggested by Ansar Raza and he said no. I again asked him can he debate or not and his respose was no he wont’ be able to debate on your terms and I have proof of this conversation.
this debate is incomplete and missing the days from July 21 to Aug4. Why the government is hiding those dates when Ahmadiyya Jamaat presented its opinion. Why not release the original camera recordings?
This is fallacious…two people of the same cult discussing what happened in their made up story. Is this suppose to be proof in your mind?
As an analogy; Its like two murderers who murdered somebody discussing how they were framed and did not murder. The credibility of their discussion will be same as the video above.
A real discussion is when you face your opponent who is knowledgeable enough and then have these discussions. Shows quite how fallacious and insecure your cult has made you
Mr. “a”
You have provided some videos from some of Ahmadi murabbis saying that “hope this will shed a lot of light on the word Zurriyat ul Baghiya” But this is completely false argument.
The truth is that Mirza did in fact use this word in many other places in derogatory terms for street women. For example
For example, in this book Mirza Ghulam has used this word in following instances:
Baghaaya: Zanaan-e-Faasiqa – Corrupt ladies. (Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.426)
Baghaaya alsouq: Zanaan-e-Bazaari – Street women. (ibid p.427)
Baghiya: Zan-e-Faahishaa – Immoral women. (ibid p.428)
Baghaaya: Zanaan-e-Bazaari (ibid p.428)
Baghaaya: Zanaan-e-Faahisha (ibid p.429)
Over the next several pages in this book Mirza has continued to use this word with the same meaning – Prostitutes. It is quite obvious that when he uses this word, it is not used to mean a disobedient person. He used this word to mean a prostitute, a harlot. So when he writes Zurriyat-ul-Baghaya, why should it mean anything different than Children of Prostitutes?
In Second argument you stated the Mirza did not Insult Hazrat Isa a.s once again for this you have quoted some Ahmadi molvies who are beating this subject around the bush rather than admitting it. You have also said that this was in retaliation to Christian Missionaries abusing the Holy Prophet. s.a.w.s. First some people wrongly abused the holy Prophet saws in his lifetime also but He never responded this way. Secondly you said that Mirza quoted from the Christian Bible. Can you provide a single statement in the Bible which Mirza quoted. The answer is there is none and it were Mirzas own words to degrade the noble personality of Hazrat Isa a.s (Jesus the Son of Mary, peace be upon them) whom Christians and Muslims respect so much. Actually this abusing of Jesus Christ pbuh, by Mirza is one of the reasons why we reject him and do not consider him as a Prophet, Messiah or Mahi or a Mujaddid. This is a fair game and there is no doubt in it. Only if you can see the reality and stop defending the lies and false teachings of the Mirza can we all be one.
@M.K
So these words are used as Arabic Idioms. They have been used not only by Mirza Sahib but several other muslims scholars in the past. Imam Bakir wrote in his book that I swear to Allah that All except Shia are Aulaad e Baghiya.
see this video at 12:35.
You never mentions anything about your own scholars but raise allegations just for the sake of opposition. He used those words for those people like Emaad ud Din who uses vulgar and abusive language for Holy Prophet SAW. But you and your scholars hide this facts and lie to muslims that Mirza Sahib wrote this and this. Just read the complete topic instead of just taking it out of context. Also your own scholars have written there is nothing wrong with this as these are commonly used as Arabic idioms.
You people talk without any proof and are just misguiding others exactly like kuffar of mecca. For people like you who tell other such things which they have heard have been declared as LIAR by Holy Prophet SAW.
The issue is Mirza Gulam is not an ordinary scholar in your eyes. He is promised Messiah, Immam menhdi and reincarnation of prophet Mohammed (PBUH) for you. And do you really wants us to reproduce here how he described his change into Isa ibne Mariam? It is a sad commentary on his part that one is even ashamed of repeating it in front of ladies.
Quran: 5:60
” Say, ‘Shall I inform you of those whose reward with Allah is worse than that? They are those whom Allah has cursed and on whom His wrath has fallen and of whom He has made apes and swine and who worship the Evil One. These indeed are in a worse plight, and farther astray from the right path”.
Will you now also raise an allegation against the Quran?
…or is this another “must do Qadiani bashing”?
Mr. “a”
The following Hadith is a clear evidence that anyone who claims to be a Prophet after Muhammad s.a.w.s is automatically a Liar (Dajjal) and there is another Hadith which says that the Dajjal will not enter Mecca or Medina and you can figure out the rest.
The Prophet (Peace be upon him) said: There will arise 30 grand Liars (Dajjal) from my Ummah, each of them will claim that he is the Prophet whereas “I AM KHATAM AN NABIYEEN AND THERE IS NO PROPHET AFTER ME” [Sunnan Tirimdhi , Hadith # 2202]
Imam Tirimdhi Said after this hadith:
هذا حديث حسن صحيح
Translation: This Hadith is “HASSAN SAHIH”
The Hadith is also narrated in Sunnan ABU Dawud, Hadith # 4252
@IB
This video will explain all you allegations about being IBN e Maryarm.
Your own reneoned Muslims scholars have described the exactly same for Holy Prophet SAW.
See this video with proofs. You have just lies and allegations which have been replied millions of time but you are so dishonest that you hide the fact that these allegations have been answered but present it as if no one in the past have ever raised them and no one has answered them.
check with your own eyes those references and enjoy.
The fact is when Ansar Raza had the best chance to defend the character and personality of Mirza Gulam, he blew it. Now trying to show all these videos holds no water. As I have said before, for all these times quadianis have been riding on our beloved prophet (PBUH) coattails. When are you going to start riding on your promised Messih’s coattails? Or are you so ashamed of his character that you don’t want to debate it in public?
Few more examples for you:
The Lies of Mirza Ghulam A Qadiani
Mahdi is not anyone’s student. I swear that this is exactly my condition Nobody can prove that any human has taught me Quran …….” (Roohani Khazain Vol 14 p. 394 by Mirza Qadiani)
At 10 years of age an Arabic Teacher was appointed for me whose name was Fazal Ahmed ….and when I was 17
-18 years of age I was educated by another Molvi Saheb whose nem was Gul Ali Shah, who was appointed by my father in Qadian to teach me.” (Roohani Khazain Vol 13. P. 180)
When I was 6-7 years old a person teacher was employed for me who taught me Holy Quran….. and his name was Fazal Ilahi.” (Roohani Khazain Vol 13. P. 180)
So in vol 13 he writes he was taught by Molvi Saheb but in vol 14 he swears nobody can prove he was taught by somebody! He is proving himself wrong! What a prophet!!
The Embezzlement of Money & The Broken Promises
Mirza Ghulam A Qadiani announced in 1879 that God has appointed him to prove the truthfulness of Islam. For this purpose he advertised that he is going to write a book, Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya, in 50 volumes. But since he was a poor man, he appealed for money! He advertised for Muslims to come forward and purchase the book in advance. He promised to send them the volumes as soon as they are printed. (Majmooa-e-Ishtehaarat, Collection of Advertisements, vol.1 p.18-19)
Muslims generously contributed and purchased the book in advance as is mentioned in the initial volumes of Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya. However after publishing 4 volumes in the next 4 years, the reality dawned on him. Now for the rest of his life probably he would be writing, publishing and distributing Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya – a book for which he has already recieved advance payments. In other words no further hope of monetary gain. He stopped writing the book. Despite protests from buyers who had made advance payments or had made generous contributions for this book. He said:
“Now God is the real and apparent incharge and caretaker of this book and I have no idea how many volumes of it (Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya ) He is going to publish it.” ( Roohani Khazain Vol 1 P. 47)
Years after years Mirza Ghulam A. Qadiani, the so-called “PROPHET, PROMISED MESSIAH, MAHDI” kept flouting his promise. For the next 23 years he wrote, published and sold some 80 other books. Fifth volume of Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya was not published until after 23 years. However if someone expected Mirza Ghulam to be remorseful about breaking his promises and embezzling the funds given to him, then he can just forget it. On the contrary he wrote in the preface of this 5th volume:
“At first I had intended to write 50 parts, but I contended with writing 5 and since the difference between 50 and 5 is that of a mere ZERO, therefore my promise is fullfilled by writing 5 volumes.”
(Roohani Khazain Vol 21. P.9)
Some Prophet !!
Like prophet like follower!
@Ib
Again same old allegations which have been replied so many times but you behave as if you are the fist one to raise this allegation. read the complete page (as you are raising allegations from a book which is taking allegations out of context.)..
here is the video of the same exact allegations that answer your questions.Read the original books and you will see how much lies your mullahs tell you.
Come on man grow up and bring some thing new. you are bring the same old allegations which have been answered millions of times. Bring something new… Your second allegation has been explained in details here
Bring some thing new… man these are all old and answered.
After viewing the posted videos I have come to one conclusion. The emperor has no clothes. In any case, I pray to almighty Allah to guide you to the right path. Ammen.
More like you don’t want to open your eyes and see the open truth.
Indeed pray for us but also pray for yourselves, maybe you are not on the right path, by rejecting the Imam of this Age.
We do not need anyone other than the best example of human being ever born i.e., Hazrat Muhammad s.a.w.s. Anyone who claims to be a new Prophet after Muhammad s.a.w.s. we consider him to be automatically a liar and outside the fold of Islam. Unto you is your deen and to us is our deen. There is no compulsion in matters of faith as truth stands clear from falsehood.
And yes, we are talking about one and only one emperor here. MGA.
@Ib
so looks like the anti-Ahmadiyya book you are using to raise the allegations is either out of more allegations or you have realized that all these allegations have already been answered so instead of cutting a sorry figure it is better to say that the grapes are sour. I answered all the allegations and each time instead that you accept that OK this is satisfactory answer you raised allegations one after another which clearly indicates that your objective is not to seek the truth rather just to find a way how to insult Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani (AS).
You are just like a Molvi in our area in Pakistan who was against Ahmadiyya Jamaat and he used to say that ” even if Allah come down to me and tell me that Mirza Sahib is a true prophet even then I will not believe him as a prophet”. So this is just the hate inside which is not letting you find the truth.
We can only pray to Allah to guide us on the correct path. Ameen.
What you are posting is a stupid discussion between two cult members of the same group. That is not called proof or an answer. Of course your other cult members being so gullible and brain washed may fall for it. Not me. I could post hundreds of similar videos against you but it is useless because your mind is controlled by your cult and what is fed to you by MIRZA FAMILY CO-OPERATIVE BANK’s directors. If you are so confident about your so called Nabi, why you refused to debate the subject “MIRZA PROPHET OR IMPOSTER” in open forum against a knowledgeable person. Funny you are asking us to seek the truth but refused to defend the bearer of this so called truth in open.
So please spare me from more load of your crap. At least not after reading enough of Mirza filth. You may continue contributing to MIRZA FAMILY CO -OPERATIVE BANK. I have no inclination or desire to contribute to this cult. Insaallah I am on the right path.
@Ib
again correct the mistake, we or Ansar Raza Did not run away. you tried to impose it without even asking Ansar Raza.
Your so called leader Farooq Khan says in public and NAMF challanges to debate on the opponents terms but soon turns on his heels and refuse to accept any suggestions from Ansar Raza. So this is not a debate at all and NAMF is becoming notorious in such debate where NAMF try to make unilateral decision.
If Ansar Raza choose a date time topic and venue and then ask Sheharyar sheikh to come to this debate will he come? I bet he won’t and same is true for Ansar Raza. Just like your imam will not come on a debate in which his permission or agreement is not taken similar is the case with Ansar Raza.
The problem is not the topic the problem is that the way NAMF initiated the debate without getting Ansar Raza involved without taking suggestions or agreement from Ansar Raza. Ansar Raza is airing the radio program for the last 12 years in Toronto Area and proving the truthfullness of MIrza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani and every week fielding tons of questions with similar allegations and responding to them. This debate was a 1 way debate and no socialized sensible person will accept that someone will try to dictate you.
@Ahmadi….If the problem is not the topic than why we don’t we see debates discussing if Mirza Gulaam was a prophet or imposter? The problem IS the Topic and you can make million excuses to disguise that. He was ready to discuss other topics on the same day, same time and same venue. The topic is head on and not beating around the bush to decide if the sky is blue or black.
However, I do not expect that any Ahmadi will ever be able to win such a debate and it will expose them without a place to hide themselves. So, Ansar is being smart by not engaging in a topic that will be a decisive blow to the cult and shatter the false stories. Mirza made approximately 12 claims from being Mujadid to Mahdi to Isa to being a composite of all the prophets and his language the whole time has been very vulgar. This is not a charge; it’s a very easily provable fact. Now, this is something Ahamdis can not hide (Mirza books are accessible by all) and thus discussing Mirza’s baseless and changing claims puts them in great difficulty.
If Ansar is truthful and can discuss this topic (no beating around the bush); he should challenge back at his convenience…..he seems to have a lot of time for the radio; im sure he can find time. If he is truthful about his email getting hacked; he should report it to the authorities and I am sure actions will be taken. However, both claims are false so he won’t do anything about that.
@islambychoice
The problem is not the topic, the problem is ethics of conducting debate. The way NAMF is conducting a debate now it is evident to all that it is not debate and it is actually DICTATE. For a debate both parties need to settle down and agree on a topic date time and venue and not like NAMF who is notorious in conducting such debates and always make unilateral decisions. At first Mr. Farooq tells a lie to the world that we will debate at your terms and then short term memory loss comes into play and he forgot that he said any such statement. Time will prove when he will face Ansar Raza in a debate.
Ahmadiiya books are available online. first your ignorant mullahs tried to ban our publications in Pakistan but Alhamdolillah we got them online now it is accessible to all and everyone can see the truth and it is being proved how much lies have been told by Anti-Ahmadiyya Mullahs in the past.
He is still challenging and saying that we can talk on the same topic but set the conditions first and all the rules first instead of making unilateral decisions. Also see one of my reply in which I told that the moderator will be changed in the 11th hours and it was actually changed as I stated.
What NAMF is stating is bunch of lies.
Ansar Raza Explained in Details on the live radio show how Sheharyar Sheikh is deceiving and telling lies to all. As proved from the previous video that NAMF will change the moderator and they infact did made unilateral decidions as shown in the video 1 week ago.
Bunch of lies by a liar Ansar who believes in a lying cult-master [Mirza] who changed his claims more times than Ansar has changed his cloths. If Ansar is truthful than let him challenge Shehayar back at his venue on the same topic “prophet or impostor” but believe me you; liars are without back-bone and he won’t do that. If he is truthful about email hack; report it to the police but guess what…….he won’t do that either because he will be charged for false reporting.
Will you be kind enough to provide evidence that Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) did change his claims?
He is kind enough not to report that NAMF used his picture and printed flyer without obtaining permission or agreement from Ansar Raza and published and distributed the flyer with his name and picture without getting permission from him. He is kind enough not to report this other wise according to canadian law this is breach of privacy and his canadian rights. If he had reported then Sheharyar sheikh and Farooq khan both of them would be seen behind the bars….. lol
@ a; let him not be kind enough and do report using his picture, hacking email and anything else you feel. The truth is that your Ansar is a liar and he is the one who sent out the flyers but later changed his mind about debating.
Its his word against NAMF; so let him prove he is truthful by filing a police report. But guess what Ahamadis..you are too used to believing in lies and fantasies that this will not cross your mind as a rational thing to do. Ansar’s lies will be exposed if he ever does report.
So basically if your truthful:
1) Report Police, File Lawsuit etc
2) If topic wasn’t the issue then let Ansar choose and venue/date and debate if Mirza was a true prophet.
I know that you liars will do none of the above. Believe in conspiracy theories such as hacking of email and time/date being the issue not the topic!
Keep on running away from debate !! bunch of liars
@Muslim
As per my brother Ib below:
First mirza claimed in 1882 he was reformer. In 1891 he claimed to be Mehdi and Messiah. Thereafter he claimed to be second advent of prophet Mohammed (PBUH) as follows
The Wahi of Mirza Ghulam
When Mirza became bold enough to talk openly about his inspirations/revelations. He thus declared openly about his WAHI:
”The basis for our claims is not Hadith but Quran and that Wahi which comes to me. Yes, in support we also present those Hadith which are according to Quran and DO NOT CONTRADICT MY WAHI. Rest of the Hadith, I THROW THEM AWAY LIKE A WASTE PAPER.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.140)
“In Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya, God has called me by the name of Ibrahim……”
(Arba’een No.3, Roohani Khazain, vol.17 p.420)
“My teachings contain orders as well as prohibitions and renovation of important injunctions of the Shari’at. For this reason God has named my teachings and the ‘wahi’ (revelation) that comes to me as a ‘boat. Thus see, God has declared my ‘wahi’, my teachings and allegiance with me to be Noah’s Ark and the basis of salvation for all human beings. Let he who has eyes may see and he who has ears may hear.”
(Arba’een, Vol. 4, footnote of page 6; Roohani Khazain, Vol. 17, p. 435).
“I say with swearing upon God that I believe in these inspirations in the same way as I believe in Quran and other books of God. And just as I consider Quran undoubtedly and surely the book of God, similarly I believe that that wahi which descends upon me is the word of God.”
(Haqeetqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.220)
“I have similar faith in my Wahi as on Holy Quran and Torah.”
(Arba’een No.4 , Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.454)
“and the Word of God descended so much on me that if it is collected it will not be less than 20 parts.”
(Haqeeqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.407)
Mirza Better than Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW (ma’azAllah):
However Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was still not satisfied with his progress. He wanted to improve further. Was it spiritual evolution or delusions of grandeur, it is anyone’s guess. His next step was claiming superiority and excellence over Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW. He said:
”But the fact is that the spirituality of Holy Prophet pbuh (in the form of Mirza Ghulam) in this end of the sixth millenium, that is in these days, is much more stronger and perfect and forceful as compared to those (first) years, like a full moon.”
(Khutba-e-Ilhamiah, Roohani Khazain vol. 16 p.271)
“The spirituality of our holy Prophet (SAW) was conceived in 5th thousand (ie Makki birth) with its precise attributes and that period was not the the climax of his spirituality’s development. It was rather the first step to the highest pinnacle of its perfection. Thereafter this spirituality manifested itself in its full glamour during the 6th thousand (his rebirth in Qadian) at the present time”.
(Mirza in Khutba-e-llhamiyah, Roohani Khazain, Vol.16, p.266)
He pointed to his followers that he has been given 300,000 signs and miracles whereas Holy Prophet was given just 3000. Praising himself, he wrote in his poetry:
“For the Holy Prophet God showed only the sign of Eclipse of Moon
But for me he has shown the sign of Eclipse of both Moon and Sun, thus will you disbelieve me.”
(Aijaz-e-Ahmadi, Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.183)
He claimed that certain concealed or secret meanings of Holy Quran were not revealed to the Holy Prophet SAAW, but he has been informed about them. Thus Holy Prophet did not understand the meaning of Ibne Maryam, Dajjal, Donkey of Dajjal, Gog and Magog, Daabatul Ardh.
(Izala-e-Auham, Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.473)
“The Islam (of Holy Prophet) started like a new moon and it was destined to become (during the time of Mirza) like a full moon.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.184)
“And it is obvious that the Fath-e-Mubeen (Distinct Victory) came during the time of our Prophet and another Victory remained, which is much greater and more obvious; and it was destined that its time would be the period of Promised Messiah.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.288)
Following poetry was recited in front of Mirza Ghulam by a follower. Mirza is reported to have said: ‘JazakAllah’ and after having written it in beautiful calligraphy, hung it in his house.
“Muhammad has descended again amongst us
and is greater in his glory than before
He who wants to see Muhammad in perfection
Should look at Ghulam Ahmad in Qadian.”
(Qazi Zahoor Ahmad Akmal Qadiani, printed in Qadiani Newspaper Paigham-us Sulh dated 14th March 1916)
”The mental development of the Promised Messiah (i.e. the Mirza of Qadian) was higher than that of the Holy Prophet (pbuh). And this is only a part of the superiority which the Promised Messiah has over the Holy Prophet. The mental faculties of the Holy Prophet could not manifest fully owing to the deficiency of civilization; although the ability existed. They have now manifested themselves fully through the Promised Masih by virtue of the advancement of civilization.”
(Review of Religions, May 1929, Qadiani Mazhab, p.266, 9th Ed. Lahore)
Mirza further degrades Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW
Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW did not understand the correct meaning of Surah AlZilzal. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 pp.166-167)Holy Prophet’s revelation also turned out to be false. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)Holy Prophet SAAW has also committed mistakes in understanding revelations. (Roohani Khazain 2 vol. 2 p.224)Grave of the Holy Prophet is one of the Most Sacred site for Muslims all over the world. This is how Mirza humiliates it (May Allah and His Messenger forgive me for quoting such profanity):
“And God chose such a DESPICABLE PLACE to bury the Holy Prophet (pbuh) which is EXTREMELY STINKING and DARK and CRAMPED and was the PLACE of the EXCRETA of INSECTS…”
(Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.205)
Claims to be the FINAL PROPHET
Having reached this far, it was not surprising that he claimed to be THE FINAL PROPHET.
”Time and again I have said that according to the verse ‘wa aakhareena minhum lamma yalhaqoo behim – and others of them who have not yet joined them..’(al-Quran 62:3) in BUROOZI form (translated by qadianis as Image/Alter-ego/Counter-type) I am the same prophet, the KHATUM-UL-ANBIYA (Last of the Prophets). And twenty years ago God named me Muhammad and Ahmad in Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya, and declared that I am the Holy Prophet’s (pbuh) incarnation. Thus my prophethood in no way clashes with the status of Holy Prophet pbuh as the Last of Prophets, because shadow is inseparable from the original. Since I am Muhammad in a ‘shadowy way’, thus this way the Seal of the Last of the Prophets is not broken, because the prophethood of Muhammad (pbuh) remained with Muhammad.”
(Mirza Ghulam in Ek Ghalti Ka Izala, Roohani Khazain vol.18, p.212)
“Blessed is he who has recognised me. Of all the paths to God I am the Last Path, and of all his Lights, I am the last Light. Unfortunate is he who forsakes me, because without me all is darkness”.
(Kashti-e-Nooh, Roohani Khazain, vol.19, p.61)
“I am the only one selected in this Ummah to get the name of ‘Prophet ‘. No one else deserved this name…. and it was bound to happen… so that as mentioned in the Sahih Hadith that ‘there will be only one such person’, that prophecy is fulfilled.”
(Haqeeqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol. 22 p.407)
“The Prophethood ended on our Prophet (pbuh). Therefore after Him there is no Prophet except who has been illuminated by His Light and who has been made His inheritor by God. Know that Finality was given to Muhammad (pbuh) since the Beginning; and then given to him (i.e. Mirza) who was taught by His Spirit and made His shadow. Thus blessed is the one who taught and blessed is the one who learned (i.e. Mirza). Thus FINALITY was destined for the SIXTH MILLENEUM, which is the sixth day in the days of God…… Thus the Promised Messiah was born in the SIXTH Millenium.”
Now in response to what i reproduced here don’t try to place video of two Ahmadi scratching each other’s back and one watching them because I have already watched it and your guy is trying to weasel out with irrelevant comparisons with the life of prophet Mohammed (PBUH). Find something better.
In response to quadiani
First mirza claimed in 1882 he was reformer. In 1891 he claimed to be Mehdi and Messiah. Thereafter he claimed to be second advent of prophet Mohammed (PBUH) as follows
The Wahi of Mirza Ghulam
When Mirza became bold enough to talk openly about his inspirations/revelations. He thus declared openly about his WAHI:
“The basis for our claims is not Hadith but Quran and that Wahi which comes to me. Yes, in support we also present those Hadith which are according to Quran and DO NOT CONTRADICT MY WAHI. Rest of the Hadith, I THROW THEM AWAY LIKE A WASTE PAPER.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.140)
“In Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya, God has called me by the name of Ibrahim……”
(Arba’een No.3, Roohani Khazain, vol.17 p.420)
“My teachings contain orders as well as prohibitions and renovation of important injunctions of the Shari’at. For this reason God has named my teachings and the ‘wahi’ (revelation) that comes to me as a ‘boat. Thus see, God has declared my ‘wahi’, my teachings and allegiance with me to be Noah’s Ark and the basis of salvation for all human beings. Let he who has eyes may see and he who has ears may hear.”
(Arba’een, Vol. 4, footnote of page 6; Roohani Khazain, Vol. 17, p. 435).
“I say with swearing upon God that I believe in these inspirations in the same way as I believe in Quran and other books of God. And just as I consider Quran undoubtedly and surely the book of God, similarly I believe that that wahi which descends upon me is the word of God.”
(Haqeetqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.220)
“I have similar faith in my Wahi as on Holy Quran and Torah.”
(Arba’een No.4 , Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.454)
“and the Word of God descended so much on me that if it is collected it will not be less than 20 parts.”
(Haqeeqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.407)
Mirza Better than Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW (ma’azAllah):
However Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was still not satisfied with his progress. He wanted to improve further. Was it spiritual evolution or delusions of grandeur, it is anyone’s guess. His next step was claiming superiority and excellence over Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW. He said:
“But the fact is that the spirituality of Holy Prophet pbuh (in the form of Mirza Ghulam) in this end of the sixth millenium, that is in these days, is much more stronger and perfect and forceful as compared to those (first) years, like a full moon.”
(Khutba-e-Ilhamiah, Roohani Khazain vol. 16 p.271)
“The spirituality of our holy Prophet (SAW) was conceived in 5th thousand (ie Makki birth) with its precise attributes and that period was not the the climax of his spirituality’s development. It was rather the first step to the highest pinnacle of its perfection. Thereafter this spirituality manifested itself in its full glamour during the 6th thousand (his rebirth in Qadian) at the present time”.
(Mirza in Khutba-e-llhamiyah, Roohani Khazain, Vol.16, p.266)
He pointed to his followers that he has been given 300,000 signs and miracles whereas Holy Prophet was given just 3000. Praising himself, he wrote in his poetry:
“For the Holy Prophet God showed only the sign of Eclipse of Moon
But for me he has shown the sign of Eclipse of both Moon and Sun, thus will you disbelieve me.”
(Aijaz-e-Ahmadi, Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.183)
He claimed that certain concealed or secret meanings of Holy Quran were not revealed to the Holy Prophet SAAW, but he has been informed about them. Thus Holy Prophet did not understand the meaning of Ibne Maryam, Dajjal, Donkey of Dajjal, Gog and Magog, Daabatul Ardh.
(Izala-e-Auham, Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.473)
“The Islam (of Holy Prophet) started like a new moon and it was destined to become (during the time of Mirza) like a full moon.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.184)
“And it is obvious that the Fath-e-Mubeen (Distinct Victory) came during the time of our Prophet and another Victory remained, which is much greater and more obvious; and it was destined that its time would be the period of Promised Messiah.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.288)
Following poetry was recited in front of Mirza Ghulam by a follower. Mirza is reported to have said: ‘JazakAllah’ and after having written it in beautiful calligraphy, hung it in his house.
“Muhammad has descended again amongst us
and is greater in his glory than before
He who wants to see Muhammad in perfection
Should look at Ghulam Ahmad in Qadian.”
(Qazi Zahoor Ahmad Akmal Qadiani, printed in Qadiani Newspaper Paigham-us Sulh dated 14th March 1916)
“The mental development of the Promised Messiah (i.e. the Mirza of Qadian) was higher than that of the Holy Prophet (pbuh). And this is only a part of the superiority which the Promised Messiah has over the Holy Prophet. The mental faculties of the Holy Prophet could not manifest fully owing to the deficiency of civilization; although the ability existed. They have now manifested themselves fully through the Promised Masih by virtue of the advancement of civilization.”
(Review of Religions, May 1929, Qadiani Mazhab, p.266, 9th Ed. Lahore)
Mirza further degrades Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW
Holy Prophet Muhammad SAAW did not understand the correct meaning of Surah AlZilzal. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 pp.166-167)Holy Prophet’s revelation also turned out to be false. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)Holy Prophet SAAW has also committed mistakes in understanding revelations. (Roohani Khazain 2 vol. 2 p.224)Grave of the Holy Prophet is one of the Most Sacred site for Muslims all over the world. This is how Mirza humiliates it (May Allah and His Messenger forgive me for quoting such profanity):
“And God chose such a DESPICABLE PLACE to bury the Holy Prophet (pbuh) which is EXTREMELY STINKING and DARK and CRAMPED and was the PLACE of the EXCRETA of INSECTS…”
(Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.205)
Claims to be the FINAL PROPHET
Having reached this far, it was not surprising that he claimed to be THE FINAL PROPHET.
“Time and again I have said that according to the verse ‘wa aakhareena minhum lamma yalhaqoo behim – and others of them who have not yet joined them..'(al-Quran 62:3) in BUROOZI form (translated by qadianis as Image/Alter-ego/Counter-type) I am the same prophet, the KHATUM-UL-ANBIYA (Last of the Prophets). And twenty years ago God named me Muhammad and Ahmad in Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya, and declared that I am the Holy Prophet’s (pbuh) incarnation. Thus my prophethood in no way clashes with the status of Holy Prophet pbuh as the Last of Prophets, because shadow is inseparable from the original. Since I am Muhammad in a ‘shadowy way’, thus this way the Seal of the Last of the Prophets is not broken, because the prophethood of Muhammad (pbuh) remained with Muhammad.”
(Mirza Ghulam in Ek Ghalti Ka Izala, Roohani Khazain vol.18, p.212)
“Blessed is he who has recognised me. Of all the paths to God I am the Last Path, and of all his Lights, I am the last Light. Unfortunate is he who forsakes me, because without me all is darkness”.
(Kashti-e-Nooh, Roohani Khazain, vol.19, p.61)
“I am the only one selected in this Ummah to get the name of ‘Prophet ‘. No one else deserved this name…. and it was bound to happen… so that as mentioned in the Sahih Hadith that ‘there will be only one such person’, that prophecy is fulfilled.”
(Haqeeqatul Wahi, Roohani Khazain vol. 22 p.407)
“The Prophethood ended on our Prophet (pbuh). Therefore after Him there is no Prophet except who has been illuminated by His Light and who has been made His inheritor by God. Know that Finality was given to Muhammad (pbuh) since the Beginning; and then given to him (i.e. Mirza) who was taught by His Spirit and made His shadow. Thus blessed is the one who taught and blessed is the one who learned (i.e. Mirza). Thus FINALITY was destined for the SIXTH MILLENEUM, which is the sixth day in the days of God…… Thus the Promised Messiah was born in the SIXTH Millenium.”
Now in response to what i reproduced here don’t try to place video of two Ahmadi scratching each other’s back and one watching them because I have already watched it and your guy is trying to weasel out with irrelevant comparisons with the life of prophet Mohammed (PBUH). Find something better.
A simple reply to your allegation with example from the Life of Holy Prophet SAW.
listen and enjoy as your allegation is busted. Again these allegations have been answered millions of time. put your grey stuff together and get something new or it is that thick that these answers don’t get into the grey matter?
and this as well
BRING SOME NEW ALLEGATIONS THESE HAVE BEEN ANSWERED LONG AGO AS INDICATED BY THE VIDEO UPLOAD DATE.
You are not the first one to raise these allegations but do pretend to be the first one to raise this allegation.
As I wrote, don’t show me the videos of your cult member scratching each other’s back. The answers given by your molvis are laughable. The guy in the first video did not even answer the question that was asked. He just said that it was quadiani belief and tried to justify with irrelevant Hadith. The funny part is somehow both guys are trying to say that according to Hadith the Nabil shall come when the camel ride will stop and the travel by cars and air will take over. And Mirza claimed prophethood during such time so he is true Nabil. Wow! Never knew people are so gullible that they will accept such a load of crap! LOL
I have recorded numerous writings of your leader with references from his books in which he claims his superiority to my Nabi (PBUH). Astagferullah. Now please post other videos of your molvis defending it so that I can laugh more. Actually why don’t you find the referenced books and read it yourself and contemplate on Mirza’s writing and his character? Don’t try to believe whatever MIRZA FAMILY CO-OP BANK’S directors are telling you. They have wasted interest in you. If you don’t believe me, just stop paying your Chanda to them for few months and see how much they love you. Eventually they will make your life hell. I guarantee you. Then you will realize they are more interested in your money, not in your hereafter. Mirza has written about 85 books. My advise? Get these books. Study them. Draw your own conclusions. If you can find them in Urdu much better. Many quadianis have revert back to Islam after they studied Mirza’s life in detail and realizing that what they were being fed by their khalifa and company was nothing but damn lies. Believe me, no sane person In this world will believe Mirza if he reads his books, ponder upon it, analyze it with open mind. Of course, if you want to continue contributing to Mirza bank and let his family members enjoy life with your hard reined money, nobody can stop you. But don’t try to tell us he was Reincarnation of Isa, Nabi and imam mahdi.He was not. He is one of those false Nabi regarding whom our prophet (PBUH) has prophesied.
Same allegations raised by mullahs and answered by Ahmadiyya Muslim Jamaat. All of them are just out of context Lies and is exactly what Jews did that they show a little bit and hide the rest. That is why Holy Prophet SAW said that My Ummat will resemble jews and your this action clearly proved the hadiths of Holy Prophet SAW and proved that you behave exactly the way Jews behaved and treated Messiah of their time and this has to happen and you have to behave exactly like jews and treat the Messiah of this Ummat the same way, otherwise the prophecy of Holy Prophet SAW would not have fulfilled.
Again all these are lies and allegations, when you see the original pages and read the complete pages you find the truth.
it is quite evident that your objective is not to seek the truth but to raise allegations and insult Mirza Sahib (AS) because each time you get a answer you jump to another allegation and then to another. When all the 70 or 80 allegations will be done you will start again from the beginning, just like jews.
May Allah guide all of us to the correct path. Ameen.
I have given clear references from his books. I bet you have not read a single book of MGA. It is beyond your intellectual capacity. You prefer to be fed by your directors of MIRZA FAMILY CO -OPERATIVE BANK. If you are sincerely seeking truth, start reading his books, preferably in Urdu. Try to obtain original prints because your directors have started deleting or amending objectionable contents. They don’t want to show Mirza in bad light otherwise their bank will crumble in no time. In that case who will give them Chanda?
@Ib…..great work! As you can see from Ahmadi responses……they are not very intellectual.
@ IB and islambychoice
there is a famous saying in urdu “KHAWAJA KAA GAWAH TATTOO”. which fits both of you.
@ IB
I have provide not only references but the audio answer as well and you can see these answers are all old and can be found on the internet. Also all your reference are from the same book against Ahmadiyyat which contain 70-75 allegations and the anti-ahmadiyya have been repeating these over and over for the last 100 years. nothing new same old stories.
No Muslim would attack Isa / Jesus Christ pbuh directly no matter what the arguments presented by the Christians.
Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, attacked Prophet Isa a.s at various places in his writings; actually this was one of his favorite pastimes. We only intend to include limited evidence and provide arguments against it. The space in this article does not permit us to include everything Mirza wrote against Prophet Isa As. Mirza’s followers can produce other proofs from the writings of Mirza to prove otherwise, but it could only prove that Mirza’s writings had contradictions and his whole purpose was to confuse the issue.
one beautiful prostitute is sitting like she is in his arms (Mirza uses word Armpits); She is putting perfume on his head by stretching her hand. She clutches his feet; sometimes she put her black hairs on his feet. Jesus is sitting like he is in a trance; if someone objects to it, he admonishes him. He is young; he having drinking habit and also being celibate. If a beautiful young prostitute lay in front of him, touching her body with his body, is this an act of a righteous person? What is the proof that her touch did not arouse Jesus desires (Here Mirza has used really foul language what he intend to say is that did Jesus had an erection?)? Sadly it was not possible for Jesus to have intercourse with his wife after encounter with this loose woman. Sexual desires must have awoken in Jesus due to her touch and his carnal desires must have gone in to full swing. Because of these desires Jesus didn’t even ask here to keep away from him. It is proven from Bible that this woman was a prostitute and she was famous in the city for fornication.
The way Mirza presented this incident in Bible; it gives reader the impression of a soft core porn video of today. Did this incident is reported like this in Bible? Or Mirza was up to his usual sinister and dirty tricks?
We explore the evidence from Bible;
Luke 7:36And one of the Pharisees desired him that he would eat with him. And he went into the Pharisee’s house, and sat down to meat. 37And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that Jesus sat at meat in the Pharisee’s house, brought an alabaster box of ointment, 38 And stood at his feet behind him weeping, and began to wash his feet with tears, and did wipe them with the hairs of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment. 39 Now when the Pharisee which had bidden him saw it, he spake within himself, saying, This man, if he were a prophet, would have known who and what manner of woman this is that toucheth him: for she is a sinner. 40 And Jesus answering said unto him, Simon, I have somewhat to say unto thee. And he saith, Master, say on. 41There was a certain creditor which had two debtors: the one owed five hundred pence, and the other fifty. 42And when they had nothing to pay, he frankly forgave them both. Tell me therefore, which of them will love him most? 43Simon answered and said, I suppose that he, to whom he forgave most. And he said unto him, Thou hast rightly judged. 44 And he turned to the woman, and said unto Simon, Seest thou this woman? I entered into thine house, thou gavest me no water for my feet: but she hath washed my feet with tears, and wiped them with the hairs of her head. 45Thou gavest me no kiss: but this woman since the time I came in hath not ceased to kiss my feet. 46My head with oil thou didst not anoint: but this woman hath anointed my feet with ointment. 47Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little. 48 And he said unto her, Thy sins are forgiven. 49 And they that sat at meat with him began to say within themselves, Who is this that forgiveth sins also? 50 And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.
We do not need to explain this any further the quote is self explanatory. But this evil Mirza presented it like a sex filled incident which could have arouse Jesus’s sexual desires. It is a simple case of a woman looking for forgiveness of her sins, crying in the process and after realizing she has wet the feet of Jesus, wiped them with her hair. Where are the sexual undertones in this incident we ask Quadianis?
@ M.K
All this could be your imagination from your mind or the mind of another anti-ahmadiyya hate monger, and allegations on Mirza Sahib. You included pages from the books written by Anti-Ahmadiyya Mullahs because these thought are coming from their mind as the mind of Anti-Ahmadiyya is filled with this filth. You quoted the paragraphs from your own books but forgot to add the references. Will you please provide the references so that people can see from which anti-ahmadiyya book you quoted these paragraphs?
@”a” and “Ahmadi”
NOW HERE IS MORE PROOF. NOW PLEASE FOR GOD’s SAKE DO NOT GO AND TELL YOUR JAMAAT TO DESTROY THIS EVIDENCE. FOR WHEN YOU ASK FOR REFERENCE THIS IS WHAT YOUR PLAN IS.
Mirza at various places attacked ISA As to allow immoral women to touch him and anoint him with oil. First quotation is from Nazul-ul-Quran (P74). Go and check it if you have any doubt left rather than blaming others without any proof.
Mirza constantly accused Jesus AS of drinking alcohol. We intend to show to the readers that Mirza was a hypocrite to call Jesus an alcoholic, it is claimed that Mirza used Tonic Wine and Opium frequently.
We produce various paragraphs from Mirza’s book Kishti-e-Noah (P73 etc).
Mirza writes; if a wealthy person drinks then he is responsible for everyone who drinks under his command and authority; O believers this world is not forever, heed my advice, forgo all wrong doing, forgo all intoxicants; not only alcohol destroy humans life but opium, cocaine; weed etc have similar effects. “
“A person who spend this short life in using what is forbidden by Khuda (Allah SWT) like it is made permissible; uses foul language in anger; injures or ready to kill someone; perform sexually permesquice acts in lust, that person would never find the true blessing.”
“The biggest loss Europeans are suffering is due to the fact that Jesus used alcohol either due to illness or old habit; but Muslims your Prophet SAW did not use any intoxicant; he SAW was innocent. Who are you following as a Muslim? Quran does not permit Alcohol like Bible. Then under what authority you claim that Alcohol is permitted? Don’t you fear death?”
Mirza’s hypocrisy exposed he did use Opium
Mirza suffered from another condition “impotency” apart from two diseases he mentioned. His impotency was a direct result of these ailments he had for years. It has been reported and claimed in many places that he used an allegedly divinely revealed medications/aphrodisiac given the name “Zad Jam-e-Ishq”. Our purpose is not to discuss his impotency here but the evidence related to cure of impotency is valid for the purpose of this article therefore, we produce this evidence from this cult’s own resources.
We find the formulae of this medication given proudly in the book Sirat-e-Mehdi.
Translation of relevant passages is as follows;
At the time of Hadarat second marriage, due to celibacy for a long period of time and supplications, he was sexually weak (impotent). He asked to prepare for his use the famous divinely revealed prescription “Zad Jam-e-Ishq.
the ingredients in Zad Jam-e-Ishq are; Saffron and Opium etc” These ingredients are grinded to make tablets and one tablet a day should be taken.
According to the evidence there is absolutely no doubt that Mirza Kazzab used the intoxicant after his second marriage until his death. Two important points worth mentioning here;
1- Mirza was impotent at the time of his second Marriage in 1886. He reportedly was cured by this allegedly divine prescription. He allegedly had 10 children with his second wife using this prescription which had opium in it.
2- Mirza claimed Prophet Hood during this period when according to his own admissions he was using the forbidden intoxicants (haram, please refer to the first quote above under current heading). He was using it for the same reasons (shawat) for which he was mocking Isa As. Most important question is; can a user of intoxicant be a Prophet? Especially if that claimant declared that he is even better then the first advent of Prophet Muhammad SAW?
Unfortunately for the followers of Mirza, his hypocrisy and lies are not limited to this, so we proceed further to unmask this liar.
Message for “a” and “Ahmadi” please come back to Islam. Mirza had made a mockery of his life. You want us to believe him as the “Imam of the Age” Ahmadis please understand we have nothing against you, we do not hate you. We are providing you black and white evidence that Mirza was a grand liar and his teachings do not make any sense for us. Why should we follow him when we have such noble Prophets from Allah s.w.t. to follow such as Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad peace be upon all of them. Please give it up. Remember arrogance is from Shaithan (devil) and not for righteous people. Please pray to Allah s.w.t and seek his guidance before it is too late.
There goes your lies. Your used abusive language for Jesus(as) / Issa(as) in your comments and claimed that paragraphs is taken from Mirza Sahib’s books and you did not even gave the references of that paragraphs, The reality is that those paragraphs are taken from the books written by your molvies and mullahs so called jahil scholars and they wrote such lies in their books and tell the people they have been taken from Mirza Sahib’s books and when asked to get the reference from where they are taken you people change the topic and raise more allegations. Now all the books are available online and anybody and see how much lies are told my these so called scholars. This is exactly what jews did to the messiah and as per Holy Prophet SAW you are doing the same exact and follow the footsteps of jews of jesus(as) exactly as prophesied by Holy Prophet SAW
Now you are insulting both Muslims and Jews. In my opinion, Muslims, the jews and christians are far better than you Ahmadis. Atleast they are not hijacking or selling their religion under a different name. Now I know you will still not get it and will blame us for lying. Ask your own so called scholar Ansar Raza and he will tell you a new Prophet (Mirza according to you and not us) means a new religion and you are shamelessly calling your religion as Islam. I cannot understand how the Ahmadis can keep arguing without and proof but fairy tales and imaginations.
@ K
I asked M.K that from where did he quoted the paragraph in which abusive language was used. This is not from any of the books of Mirza Sahib. Instead of giving me the reference you are trying to distract the attention.
My point is that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani did not used such language and that the paragraph M.K quoted is from a book written by Anti-Ahmadiyya Molvies which is full of lies. When we ask for references as all the books of Mirza Sahib are online at http://www.alislam.org then instead of producing references you try to deviate to different directions.
All this allegations are full of LIES or are out of context. All these are same old allegations which were raised by your forefathers and answered in the past, But the dishonesty of Anti-Ahmadiyya is that they hide the fact that this allegation has been answered or instead of telling us what is wrong with that answer or how it does not satisfy your mind, you simply ignore that Answer and then present the same allegation as if no one has ever answered this before.
All the readers can see that each time any allegation was answered instead of telling us how this answer is not satisfactory or how you differ from that you put forth another allegation.
Well there in your comments lies the Answer
Holy Prophet SAW said that a time will come when my ummat will resemble Jews of Jesus(as) time as if two shoes of a pair. He (SAW) compared this ummat with Jews in words that if a Jew of Jesus(as) time did zana with his mother a person within my ummat will do the same.
and thanks to your comments you are exactly fulfilling the Hadith of Holy Prophet SAW well this is the Hadith and you think it insulted jews and muslims, then what can I say.
May Allah give all of us guidance.
And thanks to your so called promissed nabi the following Hadith of my beloved prophet (PBUH) has been fulfilled.
The Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم did warn us:
· In my nation there will be 27 liars and impostors (Dajjäls). Among them will be 4 women. I am definitely the last of the prophets. There will be no prophet after me. (Musnad Ahmad: 23251)
· The [final] hour will not be established until approximately 30 liars and imposters (Dajjäls) will be sent. Each one of them will claim to be the Messenger of Allah. (Bukhäri: 7121)
Consequently it wouldn’t be farfetched to believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed was definitely one of those 27.
This allegation has been refuted here:
http://www.alislam.org/books/truth/gospels.html
“a” and Ahmadi,
While your persistence on defending your faith is admirable, your perseveration on Ansar Raza’s reasons of absence from the debate indicates your intense anxiety emanating from it. My humble advice to you is to let it go. What has happened has happened. There is no use of lamenting on spilled milk. Tomorrow is another day. Save your breath, fasten your seat belt and be ready for the release of Sheharyar Sheikh’s videos. It will reveal, I hope, the foul language that Ansar Raza has used for Sheharyar Sheikh in his communications, following the footstep of his master, MGA.
By the way, Ansar Raza can also sue Sheharyar Sheikh for breaking into his e-mail and stealing his contact addresses. If not, you know who is the lier.
DISCLAIMER: I am neither affiliated with NAMF, nor do I represent Sheharyar Sheikh.
Well it is not that Ansar Raza did not showed up at the last day. When the first flyer was sent to Ansar Raza without his agreement he responded by NAMF lied about this.
NAMF again lied that Ansar Raza Agreed to this debate and accepted it first
NAMF lied again that everything has been agreed initially
NAMF sent email to all and LIED about the moderator who is sick in hospital with Cancer , who told NAMF that he is not able to come
NAMF hide these facts as their AIM was not debate but to insult Mirza Sahib
I myself called and spoke with Farooq Khan 2 weeks before the debate and told him that Ansar Raza is not coming. He said he know but they will carry on with this program with or without Ansar Raza and this shows the Motives behind. ON the same call I told Farooq Khan that If Ansar Raza do the same and print out flyer for debate and distribut them and his respond was that it is not accetpable to them as no body can dictate them. So clearly NAMF has double standards.
First they challenge all to come and have debate on their own terms but turn on their heals and refuse the accept any terms.
Namf purposely made all the unilateral decisions about debate so that Ansar RAza might not come and then they get a chance to use abusive language for Mirza Sahib and misguide muslims.
you can see on the youtube there are several successful debates in which Ansar Raza went and numerous are on the way but this particular was not debate at all as there was no agreement.
We do not trust Ansar Raza. We follow Holy Quran and Hadith.
Take some deep breaths “a”. You seem to be Ansar Raza’s buddy. I was imagining you to be a much younger man.
You did not comment on suing Sheharyar Sheikh for breaking into Ansar Raza’s e-mail account.
@ Hamza
Ansar Raza has already answered this suing thing on the radio program in his answer to a caller who even lied that Tarek Fateh was a Qadiani. So now NAMF is stating that Tarek Fateh was also a Qadiani. LOL
Crystal clear proof in Holy Quran about Prophet Muhammad s.a.w.s. being the seal and last of the Prophets of Allah s.w.t. This evidence is backed by abundance of Authentic Hadith. So do we still need some Mirza or Ansar Raza to give a different opinion? A wise person would say no, only a foolish person will still argue. You choose who you want to be, a Muslim or Ahmadi.
Surah 33. Al-Ahzab, Ayah 40
مَا كَانَ مُحَمَّدٌ أَبَا أَحَدٍ مِنْ رِجَالِكُمْ وَلَٰكِنْ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ وَخَاتَمَ النَّبِيِّينَ ۗ وَكَانَ اللَّهُ بِكُلِّ شَيْءٍ عَلِيمًا
Asad:
[And know, O believers, that] Muhammad is not the father of any one of your men, 50 but is God’s Apostle and the Seal of all Prophets. 51 And God has indeed full knowledge of evervthing.
Malik:
Muhammad is not the father of any of your men (he is not going to leave any male heirs). He is the Rasool of Allah and the Seal of the Prophets. Allah has the knowledge of all things.
Pickthall:
Muhammad is not the father of any man among you, but he is the messenger of Allah and the Seal of the Prophets; and Allah is Aware of all things.
Yusuf Ali:
Muhammad is not the father of any of your men but (he is) the Apostle of Allah and the Seal of the Prophets: and Allah has full knowledge of all things.
The abundance of Hadith also state that he was the First prophet. Now take that literally, then you’ll end up with one prophet. What’s more Hudhur (sa) has been labeled first and last, so me and you must not exist..
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=KpumztW4VhM&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DKpumztW4VhM&gl=GB
This is how Mirza degrades our Nabi (PBUH) in his books. It has clear references, book name and page from where it is taken from His books. This is tip of the iceberg. The brothers trying to defend him should get original prints in urdu and verify it themselves.
Mirza degrades Holy Prophet Muhammad – Ijthaadi Mistake:
When Mirza Sahib kept commiting mistakes after mistakes and his prophecies kept turning out to be false one after the other, then he commited that blunder which sealed his fate forever as KAAFIR. He started accusing other Prophets of Allah and especially Holy Prophet Muhammad of making similar mistakes. This was the height of his slanderous attacks. He wrote about Holy Prophet that:
Holy Prophet’s revelation also turned out to be false. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)
Holy Prophet did not understand the correct meaning of Surah alZilzal. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)
Holy Prophet has also commited mistakes in understanding revelations. (Several examples eg. Roohani Khazian vol2 p.224)
THE FINAL INSULT:
The Grave of Holy Prophet Muhammad is a source of blessing and light and has been revered by generations after generations sinc the time of Sahaba till this day. No Muslim has ever dared to violate the sanctity of this Holiest of the Holy Shrines. But this so-called Aashiq-e-Rasool and Fana fir Rasool did not even spare that. May Allah forgive me for quoting such profanity:
“And God chose such an ignominious place to hide/bury the Holy Prophet that is awfully stinking and dark and cramped and the place of excreta of insects…” (Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.205)
Should we say more? May Allah open your eyes.
@ IB
Lies and out of context. All these are lies and nothing but the lies. Now tell the name of the book that you are using to tell us these lies.
I can just say Laanat Allah he Aalal Kazabeen.
Lies?????? I gave you the names of Mirza books with page numbers and still it is lies? Classic example of pot telling a kettle black. Why don’t you check out yourself? But I know you will not do it because you prefer to believe in what your jamat is feeding you. If you want to see biggest lier, look at the picture of MGA and your khalifas. I would say for them Laanat Allah he Aalal Kazabeen.
In any case here are few books and other references of your leader for you to check out. Don’t ask your jamat because they will tell you to stay away from his books. They only expose selective parts and books to you. You will see how he praises my prophet first and after slanders him.
Roohani Khazain vol.6 p.292-292
Seeratul Mahdi part 1 p.34
Roohani Khazain vol.18 p.587; Roohani Khazain vol.15; Maktoobaat-e-Ahmadiyya vol.5; Seeratul Mahdi by Mirza Basheer Ahmad; Review of Religions.
Roohani Khazain vol.5 p.325
Roohani Khazain vol.15 p.201
AlBushra vol.2 p.105
Roohani Khazain vol. 13 p.350
Maktoobaat-e-Ahmadiyya vol.5 letter no. 4
Roohani Khazain vol.12 p.270
Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.521
Ek Ghalti Ka Izala, p.8; Roohani Khazain, vol.18,p.212
Maktoobat-e-Ahmadiyya vol 5 No 2 & 4; Tiryaq-ul-Quloob, Roohani Khazain, vol 15 p.203; statement of Mirza Mehmood son of Mirza Ghulam, AlFazl Newspaper, Qadian, vol 17 No. 6 dated 19th July 1929; Seeratul Mahdi vol.3 p.218
Khotoot Imam Benam Ghulam, p. 5, Majmue Maktoobat, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad; Qadiani Mazhab, p. 168
Nuzool-e-Maseeh, Roohani Khazain vol.18 p.587 by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad
Roohani Khazain vol.22 p.89; Tazkirah 2nd Edition p.142/626
Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.192; Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.295; Collection of Advertisements vol.3 p.435
Roohani Khazain vol.19 pp.87-89
@IB
I’ve read El Ghalti ka Izala. Nowhere he (as) has attempted to show his supiriority or equality of Prophet Muhammad (sa), the greatest of all Prophets. Question is have you read it, or you just like pasting from hate sites?
The so called Imam of the age “Mirza Gulam Ahmad Qadiani”, the founder of Ahmadiyya Movement claimed:
“God has revealed to me in his special inspiration that Maseeh ibne Maryam is dead.” (Tauzeeh-e-Maram, Roohani Khazain vol 3 p.402)
So MIRZA claimed that Hazrat Masseh Ibne Maryam a.s. is dead and then gave three different places as his burial sites. If you do not believe me, see the references below with your own eyes:
1) “I have been informed about the grave of Eisa (in Kashmir).” (Roohani Khazain vol 18 p.358, 361)
2) “This is true that Maseeh went to his native place, and died there, but this is not true that the same body which was buried, became alive again….. verse 3 chapter I of Acts is a testimony about the natural death of Jesus that took place in Al-Khaleeli. After this death, Maseeh was visible to his students as KASHF (vision) for 40 days.” (Izala-e-Auham, Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.353-354)
3) “O Hazrat Maulana & My Imam. Assalamo alaikum wa rehmatullah wa barakaatohu. I pray that may Allah give you cure (I recieved this letter of Shaami Saheb during my illness) Whatever you have asked about the Grave of Eisa alaihe assalam and other events, thus I am writing to you in detail, and that is this: Hazrat Eisa alaih assalam was born in Bait-ul-Lehm and between Bait-ul-Lehm and Quds there is a distance of thirty miles and the Grave of Hazrat Eisa alaihe assalam is in the Country of Quds, and is present till now, and there is a Church built on it, and that church is the largest church of all churches, and inside it is the Grave of Hazrat Eisa and in the same church is the Grave of Maryam, the truthful. And both graves are separate.” (Atmam-ul-Hujjat, Roohani Khazain vol.8 p.299)
Now Ahmadis are trying to sell this man as the “Imam of the Age”. The one who is a consistent liar and a proven one can be the Imam of the Age? Ahmadis use some common sense please, why are your misleading others and trying to hijack the religion of Islam by inserting the corrupt teachings of Mirza the Dajjal.
I will leave you with the following Hadith:
The Prophet (Peace be upon him) said: There will arise 30 grand Liars (Dajjal) from my Ummah, each of them will claim that he is the Prophet whereas “I AM KHATAM AN NABIYEEN AND THERE IS NO PROPHET AFTER ME” [Sunnan Tirimdhi , Hadith # 2202]
You have such a negative and evil personality that you just looks for those negatives and bad things told the Anti-Ahmadiyya Molvies without even confirming them from the original books. This is sufficient enough to consider that person as liar.
Your so called molvies perhaps hide this truth that Mirza Sahib praised Holy Prophet a lot way lot that you so called scholars have even imagined.
and
and
and there are many more including the Qaseeda written by Mirza Sahib in praise of Holy Prophet. This qaseeda was written in Arabic and all those who hear this always that that the author of this qaseeda possess such a great Love for Holy Prophet SAW that it is UN-imaginable
BUT ALAS YOUR SCHOLARS HIDE THESE FACTS AND JUST PRESENT THE LIES WHICH YOU ARE MENTIONING IN YOUR COMMENTS
Also see this Mehzar Nama was read in the 1974 assembly of Pakistan but Molvie hide these facts. This shows how much Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani (AS) praised and Love Holy Prophet SAW. The released decision is also missing the first few days because these were read in the Assembly……
Only an unjust or liar can say that Mirza Sahib insulted Holy Prophet SAW. The love for Holy Prophet SAW is clearly visible from the writings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani (AS).
MULLAHS AND MOLVIES HIDE THESE AND ALSO BAN THE AHMADIYYA PUBLICATION IN PAKISTAN SO THAT MUSLIM MIGHT FIND THE TRUTH AND THE LIES OF MULLAHS WILL BE EXPOSED TO ALL.
Mirza began with his claim of reformer. At that time he lavishly praised our beloved prophet. Quadianis always show that part of his life. (there is video posted on this on this site to demostrate how Great his love was regarding our prophet) In his later days when he kept on climbing the ladder of his foolish claims and in the end when he claimed he is Nabil, he started slandering our prophet. Whenever you mention this part of his life quadianis don’t want to here it. Even if you provide names of Mirza’s books and page numbers, they will tell it as our lies. So when they post their videos of their cult members patting each other, it is truth but when we give evidence with names of his books, it is called lies.
Now the readers would realise how this belief of the myth of Mirza Ghulam love of prophet degenerated into accepting all the other heretical claims.
In response to such claims of the founder of Ahmadiyya Movement, Syed Abdul Hafeez Shah had written following response to Mr. Riyaz Ahmad Arshad. This deals with issues related to Ishq-e-Rasool and Fana fil Rasool.
I had reproduced some part of it earlier in my post and more of it is posted here. We only pray that Allah guide us all to the right path.
Dear Mr. Riyaz Ahmad Arshad
Wa alaikum assalam
Thank you for your letter. Your attachment to the Holy Prophet and in that regards your good faith in me has given me hope that if you ponder on this Hadith {You are not faithful unless you love me more than your father, your son and the whole mankind. (Bukhari)} inshaAllah one day you will arrive at the truth.
Following is some of the poetry written in praise of Holy Prophet Muhammad expressing poet’s intense love and passion for him. Just see how poets have beautifully expressed their thoughts with charming words containing deep love.
(since the poetry is in Urdu as an image, i was not able to paste it in this post)
I am sure you will agree that these poets have elegantly expressed their passionate love (ishq) for the Holy Prophet of Islam, much more beautifully than your Mirza Ghulam A. Qadiani ever did. Question is: What does this expression of love signifies? You would be surprised to hear that these poets were non Muslims and died as such. their beautiful poetry could not guide them to Islam. Among them were Munshi Durgasahaye, Suroor Jahanabadi, Rana Bhagwandas, Jagan Nath Azad, Kabeer Das etc.
You have cleverly avoided answering my questions (regarding the heretical writings of Mirza Sahib) and tried to prove that Mirza Sahib was Aashiq-e-Rasool and Fana fir Rasool, and in the end by saying “the biggest proof is the Ishq and Love” you have tried to justify his claims to prophethood and messiahship. Leaving aside what does Mirza Sahib say about the criteria to judge his truthfulness and falsehood, let us talk about your own criterion of mirza Sahib’s truthfulness.
What is Ishq and Aashiqee?
To understand this, you must understand certain basic things.
Acquaintance and unfamiliarity are two opposite things. When one hears of someone in the beginning, then this unfamiliarity changes into a familiarity. As one keeps hearing the goodness of this person, one develops an attachment, which progresses to affection and this is the beginning of love. When this love increases, the lover starts feeling as if he is getting consumed by this love. Gradually and insidiously SHAWQ (intense desire) for the beloved is generated in the heart of lover. This desire is in fact a gift of beloved, it is not something which one can achieve by his efforts. Time comes when this love is established in the heart of lover and this shawq nourishes this seedling of love. As much the beloved is hidden, the shawq increases and is gradually transformed into fire of passionate love otherwise known as ISHQ.
This station of Ishq is reserved for only those pious souls who are close to Allah. The heat of ishq keeps them constantly restless. The bounties of Allah and His blessings gradually intoxicates them and time comes when they loose their self-control, they pass beyond the world of senses. Their ishq progresses to JUNOON (lunacy), the fire of ishq burn them to the core. Now they are of no use, neither for themselves nor for others, neither for this world nor for hereafter. They reach a stage where they are bound by no laws, neither the laws of Shariah nor the worldly laws. Such selected souls are beyond the stage where they can teach anyone anything.
This is the ultimate station on the way of sulook and is called Fana fi Allah (Annihilated in Allah). To reach this stage one has to pass through the stages of fana fi as-Shaikh and fana fi Rasool. These two stages are just a temporary phases in the trainning of saalik. Master or murshid initially generates his love in the heart of his mureed (disciple) and as soon as mureed reaches the stage of fana fis Shaikh, Shaikh sends him towards Holy Prophet, so that he may progress to the next stage. If Shaikh doesn’t do that and leaves him at the stage of Fana fil Shaikh, then mureed becomes an idolater and kaafir.
In any case the stations of Fana fir Rasool and Fana fil Allah are absolutely an act of Graciousness of Prophet Muhammadand a gift which He bestows upon His servant. Every saalik (seeker) keeps walking on the path towards this zenith of perfection but not everyone reaches this peak. Ghaus, Qutub and Abdaal reach the peak and become witness of Holy Prophet Muhammad; they progress from sure knowledge (‘Ilm-ul-Yaqeen) through visual confirmation (‘Ain-ul-yaqeen) to the station of sure and evident truth (Haqq-ul-yaqeen). Such specially chosen people after their ‘Odyssey towards Allah’ (Sair ila Allah) and ‘Odyssey in Allah’ (Sair fil Allah) reaches a stage from where no news is heard of them.
But those pioous souls who are chosen by Allah for the betterment of his creatures, they are returned back from this Sair filAllah so that they can remain within their senses, bounded by the Shariat of Holy Prophet Muhammad, to guide the humanity.
Can a Prophet also be a Saalik?
Here it is important to keep this point in mind that all these stations on the path towards Allah (Sulook) are for saalik (seeker on the path) and a Prophet or a Messenger of Allah is Siraj-us-Salikeen (Light for the Seekers on the path) and not a saalik. There is neither a need for the Prophet and Messenger to go through the phase of Fana Fis Shaikh nor any Prophet has ever annihilated in the love of another Prophet (Fana fir Rasool). There are examples of two Prophets being present at the same time, one being superior than other, as evident from Quran but there is not a single instance of a subordinate Prophet being annihilated in the love of other Prophet. eg. Syedna Abraham AS and his nephew Syedna Lut AS, Syedna Eisa ibne Maryam AS and Syedna Yahya AS, Syedna Musa AS and Syedna Haroon AS, Syedna Yaqoob AS and Syedna Yusuf AS and so on.
Similarly there is no need for a Prophet to go through the phase of Fana fi Allah. The gnosis of Prophets of Allah is totally different from the gnosis achieved by Auliya Allah (friends of Allah). The odyssey of Rasoolullah was entirely different from the Sair ila Allah of Auliya Allah. His was with his body and soul and that of Allah’s friends was with soul only. Consequently the best possible station of Auliya Allah is inferior to the lowest grade of Prophets, because this status is not achievable, it is bestowed by Allah. Allah chose and appointed His Prophets on the day of Azal (beginning of creations). Not only that, He even took pledge from all the Prophets to be subservient to the Holy Prophet Muhammad as mentioned in Quran:
When Allah made (His) covenant with the Prophets, (He said): Behold that which I have given you of the Scripture and knowledge. And afterward there will come unto you a messenger, confirming that which ye possess. Ye shall believe in him and ye shall help him. He said: Do ye agree, and will ye take up My burden (which I lay upon you) in this (matter)? They answered: We agree. He said: Then bear ye witness. I will be a witness with you. (Quran 3.81)
Holy Prophet said: I was a Prophet even when Adam was between water and clay. It is this Glorious and Magnificent Prophet whose pious heart was given so much endurance by Allah that it absorbed the mountain-crushing impact of the Sound of Allah – ‘Quran’ which no one else could bear.
Allah thus says in Quran:
Say: “I am but a man like yourselves (but) the inspiration has come to me that your Allah is one Allah… (Quran 18.110)
And this has made a world of difference between the Holy Prophet Muhammad and an ordinary human being.
But Alas! there are people like Mirza Ghulam A. Qadiani who had always striven to denigrate the status of Holy Prophet. Just look at this example:
“He who differentiates between me and Mustafa,
has neither known me nor seen me.”
(Roohani Khazain vol.16 p.259)
What an audacity! Where a Magnificent personage like Holy Prophet and where a person like Mirza Ghulam A. Qadiani who could not even recite a small chapter in prayers without getting a hysterical attack.!!
Similarly Mirza Sahib alleges that archangel Gabriel has never came on earth! How right he is. Gabriel was the angel who used to bring revelations to the Prophets of Allah. Since Mirza Sahib never really received WAHI or revelation, so for once he was quite right that Gabriel never on earth for him.
Question comes to mind: who was the angel that was bringing WAHI to Mirza Sahib and what was the real nature of such revelation? Eel, Teechee Teechee, Durshani, Khairaatee were the names of some of these angels!!
Read Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya carefully. Mirza repeatedly quotes the verses from Quran as his inspirations in this book. Later in his other books he refers to these writings, saying: “And as God mentions in Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya….” as if Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya is the book of God. (Ma’azAllah). People talk about alteration in the verses of Quran, here Mirza Sahib has pilfered most of the Quran.
Slandering the Holy Prophet
Mr. Riyaz! You talk of love and ishq of Rasoolullah, what kind of graceless, shameless and degenerate lover was Mirza that ALL those verses of Quran that Allah revealed in honour of his beloved (Rasoolullah), he started applying on himself. Pick up Haqeeqat-ul-Wahi and from pages 73-111 & 705-715 Mirza Sahib has mentioned his Wahi. you will notice wholesale plagiarization of the verses of Quran. Among them are those verses which were revealed to Glorify Holy Prophet but which now according to Mirza Sahib have been revealed again to glorify Mirza!!
I am sure anyone would recognise the verses glorifying the Holy Prophet of Islam. But Mirza Sahib has shamelessly claimed that they have been revealed again glorifying him.
Another example of the slanderous attack on Holy Prophet:
“The basis for our claims is not Hadith but Quran and that Wahi which comes to me. Yes, in support we also present those Hadith which are according to Quran and DO NOT CONTRADICT MY WAHI. I THROW AWAY REST OF THE HADITH LIKE A WASTE PAPER.” (Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.140)
Mirza Sahib also had this sickness that he considered himself either equal to or better than other Prophets. Consequently in trying prove himself better than Holy Prophet Muhammad he initially hijacked the glorifying verses. But when he was not satisfied with this, he started writing poetry proving himself superior to Rasoolullah. For example:
“For him (Rasoolullah) only the sign of Lunar Eclipse appeared
And for me both Lunar and Solar eclipse. Now will you reject me?”
(Roohani Khazain vol.19 p.183)
You will notice that not only he has tried to prove himself superior to Holy Prophet but also denied the miracle of splitting of the Moon and labeled it as eclipse!
In another book, Khutba-e-Ilhamiyah, he labeled the Islam of Holy Prophet Muhammad as Hilal, the new moon but his own Islam as Badr, the full moon. (Roohani Khazain vol.16. p.184)
Following poetry was recited in front of Mirza by his follower. Mirza Sahib is reported to have said JazakAllah and after having written the following quartet in beautiful calligraphy, had is hung in his house:
“Muhammad has descended again amongst us
An is greater in his glory than before
He who wants to see Muhammad in perfection
Should look at Ghulam Ahmad in Qadian.”
(Poetry by Qazi Zahoor Ahmad Akmal Qadiani, printed in
AlBadr Qadian dated 25th October 1906
and Paigham-e-Sulh Qadian dated 14th March 1916)
Mirza Further degrades Holy Prophet Muhammad – Ijthaadi Mistake:
When Mirza Sahib kept commiting mistakes after mistakes and his prophecies kept turning out to be false one after the other, then he commited that blunder which sealed his fate forever as KAAFIR. He started accusing other Prophets of Allah and especially Holy Prophet Muhammad of making similar mistakes. This was the height of his slanderous attacks. He wrote about Holy Prophet that:
Holy Prophet’s revelation also turned out to be false. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)
Holy Prophet did not understand the correct meaning of Surah alZilzal. (Roohani Khazain vol.3 p.472)
Holy Prophet has also commited mistakes in understanding revelations. (Several examples eg. Roohani Khazian vol2 p.224)
THE FINAL INSULT:
The Grave of Holy Prophet Muhammad is a source of blessing and light and has been revered by generations after generations sinc the time of Sahaba till this day. No Muslim has ever dared to violate the sanctity of this Holiest of the Holy Shrines. But this so-called Aashiq-e-Rasool and Fana fir Rasool did not even spare that. May Allah forgive me for quoting such profanity:
“And God chose such an ignominious place to hide/bury the Holy Prophet that is awfully stinking and dark and cramped and the place of excreta of insects…” (Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.205)
MA’AZALLAH summa MA’AZALLAH. Is this what you call Love of Rasoolullah?
Prophecies
Although you have labeled Love and Ishq as the proof of Mirza Sahib’s truthfulness, which again I have shown above to be a false propaganda, I beg to disagree that this is not the proof of his claims to Prophethood since it is your word against your prophet’s and I am sure you would agree that it is his words that count.
Thus he said:
“To judge our truthfulness and lies there can be no better criteria than our PROPHECIES.” (Aina-e-Kamalaat-e-Islam, Roohani Khazain vol.5, p.288)
Similarly at another place he said:
“He who is a LIAR in his claim, his prophecy is never fulfilled.” (Roohani Khazain vol.5 p.223)
“If it is proven that out of hundred prophecies even if one turns out to be false, I will admit that I am a liar.” (Roohani Khazain vol.17 p.421, footnote)
“If Atham did not recieve punishment with death (as prophecied) within the stipulated time, then I am prepared to accept any punishment, humiliate me, paint my face black, put a rope around my neck and hang me. I am prepared for everything and I swear by God AlMighty that he will definitely do as I said, definitely do it, definitely do it. Earth and Heavens can move but His words will not fail.” (Roohani Khazain vol.6 p.293)
After such boastful claims, now let me ask you the fate of some of the famous prophecies of Mirza Sahib which he had boasted specifically to be a sign of his truthfulness.
The Divine Marriage of Mirza Sahib with Mohammedi Begum. God informed him that he will not die before this mariage. you know as well as i do that Mohammedi Begum and her husband outlived Mirza by 40 years.
The death of Christian priest, Deputy Abdullah Atham. Atham did not die within the stipulated time, despite prayers by Mirza and his followers, despite Mirza’s attempts to cast some magic spells in a disused well etc.
The marriage with two ladies – a virgin and a widow. Which widow did Mirza marry, can you tell us?
Prophecy regarding the birth of a baby boy to the wife of his disciple, Manzoor Ahmad. But unfortunately it was baby girl, who died shortly after birth and before Mirza Sahib could twist the prophecy into some future pregnancy, the lady also passed away.
Prophecy regarding Death of Mirza in either Makkah Mukarramah or Madina Munawwarah. Would you tell us where did he die?
Melancholia, other Illnesses, drugs and alcohol
Question is then what is the meaning of these inspirations, these prophecies and then these slanderous behaviours? If you study the life of Mirza Sahib with an open mind, all the facts will become clear as a daylight. Mirza Saheb belonged to a family who were loyal servants of British Rulers of India. He was of a weak mind from early days of his life and his father used to discourage him from indulging too much in reading books lest he would loose his mind. When he reached maturity, he absconded with the pension of his father and spent it in immoral pursuits. Later he took up a menial job in City Court in Sialkot at Rs. 15 per month. There he learnt some English but failed the Mukhtaari exam. In 1868 while he was still working as a clerk in the court, he met a Christian Padre who was later instrumental in his selection to the post of ‘Apostolic Prophet’.
When Mirza Saheb was about 38 years old his father died and Inspirations and revelations started showering on him like rain. Were these really inspirations or an indication of mental illness? He sustained the first attack of hysteria when his son, Basheer I, dies. When he undertook second marriage, he was IMPOTENT. Then upon divine inspiration he prepared a potion, ‘DIVINE CURE’, its main constituent was OPIUM. During his correspondence with Hakeem Nuruddin, he admitted to be suffering from following sicknesses. Here you must remember that Mirza was taught medicine by his father. :
Melancholia
Hypochondriasis
Insomnia
Diabetes
Amnesia
Urinating 100 times a day
Attacks of hysteria
Attacks of fits of heart
Attacks of unconciousness
And on top of all these sicknesses, use of OPIUM and ALCOHOL!!
In other words MENTAL SICKNESS + OPIUM = HALLUCINATIONS which he misinterpreted as INSPIRATIONS.
Perhaps you might think that previous Messengers were also accused of being mental case by their opponents, so it is no big deal if we also call Mirza Saheb the same. BUT let me clear the confusion. NO PROPHET of Allah has ever labelled himself as a mental case, a lunatic. Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is the only claimant of prophethood who had admitted in his writings being mentally sick.
It was the sequel of his Mental Sickness + Opium that when Britihsers decided to create an Imposter ‘Apostolic’ Prophet to eliminate the spirit of Jehad from the hearts of Muslims, they searched for a proper person. Finally they chose the mentally defected son, an opium/alcohol user and pusher, of their ancestral servant, Mirza Ghulam Murtaza, who had proven his loyalty by supplying 50 armed horsemen to fight against the Muslims in the freedom struggle of 1857.
Mirza Ghulam Qadiani Saheb admitted to this appointment in his letter to the then Governor General of Punjab by saying that he is the ‘SELF CULTIVATED SEEDLING’ of British Raj and had rendered such services which had never been performed by any other Muslim. He wrote a lenghthy letter to Queen Victoria entitled ‘GIFT TO THE EMPRESS’ in which he reminded her of his services in the following words:
“For the sake of British Government, I have published and distributed 50,000 leaflets (against Jehad) in this country and other Islamic countries …. the result is that hundreds of thousands of people have given up their filthy ideas about Jehad.” (Roohani Khazain vol.15 p.114)
And this was the mental sickness that was aggravated by Opium and Alcohol that Mirza Saheb kept claiming one thing after another. He started his campaign as a Servant of Islam and a Debator, then progressed to Mujaddid (Rejuvenator), Maseel Maseeh (Resemblance with Messiah), Promised Messiah and even adopted the titles of PROPHET and MESSENGER. Then his sickness forced him to usurped the names of ALL PROPHETS. He became Adam, Seth, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Moses, David, Solomon, Mariam, Eisa ibne Maryam (upon them be peace) and finally started calling himself the second advent of Holy Prophet Muhammad. Now whoever opposed him and did not accept his prophethood was labelled as Bastard and children of prostitute. (Roohani Khazain vol.5 p.547)
Despite all these claims, he did not get him any respite from his Mental Illness. Now he started having visions that he is the wife of God and God has expressed His power of virility with him. (Astaghfir Allah). Finally he got inspirations that he is son of God, God himself and God will be born as his son. (Roohani Khazain vol.13 p.103)
If you honestly think, all these jugglary was the result of Mirza Saheb’s mental sickness which was affecting his hearing and vision resulting in auditory and visual hallucinations respectively. Well, Mirza Saheb was a sick man, I am surprised at educated and wise people like you who despite knowing everything are totally ignorant. Mirza Saheb had really cornered all Qadianis by stating that he who has not read all his books at least three times, his faith is in doubt. (Seerat-ul-Mahdi vol.2 p.78)
I can say without any shadow of doubt that no present day Qadiani has read all his books three times. If he had, it would have been enough to open his eyes.
IN CONCLUSION, I have exposed the myth of ISHQ-e-RASOOL in which you are trapped. For God’s sake think with an open mind. Firstly NO PROPHET HAD EVER BEEN A LOVER OF ANOTHER PROPHET. Secondly DOES ONE EVER SLANDERS HIS BELOVED? One looks for the virtues of his beloved and not mistakes.
The yardstick to judge the prophethood is neither love/ishq nor prophecies. It is the message brought by the prophet that proves his truth. Please clear this misunderstanding in your heart and then read Mirza Saheb’s books with an open mind. I pray to Allah that may He give you the insight to differentiate between truth and falsehood and then guide you to the right path.
Ameen.
Among so many you are the first Qadiani who had written such clear letters with so much affection. I do not want you to back off and stop writing to me. I would be grateful if you would correct any wrong thing mentioned in my letter, and accept what is the truth.
Allah is the one who gives guidance
Wassalam
Sd: Syed Abdul Hafeez
P O Gujjo
District Thatta
Sindh, Pakistan.
Unfortunately, I’m unable to read Urdu, but where there are translations available, I have at times personally gone to check the relevant quotation myself, allegedly taken to be abusive towards the Prophets, and have always always come to the conclusion that all have been taken out of the context and hence have not been understood by the quotee. Examples of books include Misconceptions Removed and more importantly Message of Peace, the last book written by the Promised Messiah (as), hence thrashing the wicked argument that as time went by Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) elevated himself even higher than Hadhrat Muhammad (sa), the Seal of the Prophets.
Ahmadi,
So you are suggesting that you did find examples of Mirza’s tirade against prophet Mohammed (PBUH) in few of his books you could gather. However According to you it is taken out of context so not a valid argument. Please explain to us why a so called Nabi will slander the best prophet and write in derogatory terms in the first place? What context or situation or surrounding has to do with it in any way?
No wonder Mirza’s prophesy that he would die in either Mecca or Medina was never fulfilled. Forget about his death, even when he was alive, Mirza stayed away from visiting these holy places.
That was a fitting punishment from Allah for the abusive Mirza.
Here’s my copy/paste response to your long copy/paste
Introduction
Beneath a post we published on Monday, an anonymous commentator politely asked us our opinion on a particularly long page of propaganda from an anti-Ahmadiyya website. The page contained numerous allegations against Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, mostly related to his writings on Jesus a.s. The questioner was particularly interested in the allegation that Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad used degrading language towards the prophet of God, Jesus a.s. We have promised the commentator that we will provide a thorough and comprehensive response to every allegation on that page and will do so insh’Allah within a month (by mid-May). We have referred the propaganda to Sufi Sage who is currently going through it point by point. However, whilst we await his exhaustive research we would like to offer our own briefer analysis, which we hope will satisfactorily cover the main points contained within the allegation.
The Accusation
For the sake of such innocent readers who have no prior experience of such allegations, we would like to offer one of the passages which has been quoted from Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s writings on the site in question:
“It is extremely shameful that the Sermon of the Mount, which forms the core of the New Testament was plagiarised by Jesus from the Jewish book, The Talmud, and then he pretended as if it were his own teachings. But since the time this plagiarism has been discovered, the Christians have been suffering a great shame. Jesus committed this act (of forgery) to perhaps gain influence by presenting some good teachings. (Zamima Anjam-e-Atham, Roohani Khazain vol 11 p.290)
Taking such quotations, the anti-Ahmadiyya group have alleged that Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad accused Jesus of being a shameful forger of lies. The same site raises numerous objections against similar passages about Jesus from the writings of Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. As always though, to fully appreciate the import of these writings, context is paramount. However, today it will not be the context of the book the writings are from which we will examine, but historical context.
Historical Context
As the British Empire conquered the subcontinent, a regular flow of Christian missionaries were gaining an ever more influential foothold in India. Much of the local Indian population was Muslim and the Christians employed a particularly distasteful tactic in their efforts against Islam. They would raise the most vile and absurd accusations against The Holy Prophet s.a.w. and his teachings. These attacks reached a particularly low nadir with the publication of Hidayatul Muslimeen by a Christian man named Imam-ud-Din. This publication was so disgusting that even a Christian newspaper called Shamsul Akhbar commented in 1875, ‘There is nothing more detestable than padre Imad-ud-Din’s publications which contain foul expressions.’
The Christians had found an incredibly effective strategy. The Muslims were paralysed. They were hearing the Holy Prophet s.a.w. of Islam insulted left, right and centre by Christians, but had no means to reply in turn, as their religious reverence of Jesus a.s. would not allow them to do so.
Consequently, the tactics of the Christian preachers were so successful in India that by 1888 1 million Christians were found in a country that just a few years previously had had next to none. The Christian governor of Punjab, Charles Aitchison noted, ‘It may surprise some who have not had an opportunity of looking into the matter to learn that Christianity in India is spreading four or five times as fast as the ordinary population and that the native Christians now number a million souls.’
It was in this dangerous atmosphere, where the British government itself was protecting and supporting it’s Christian missionaries, that Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad suggested that people of all religions should show mutual respect. He encouraged humanity to desist from insulting one another’s religious leaders and instead focus on praising the good teachings of their own religions.
Sadly, little notice was taken of Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s wise advice and by 1897 the Christians of India had gained such confidence from their success against Islam that a Christian preacher named Ahmad Shah wrote a book titled Ummatul Momineen, which was wholly devoted to abusing the wives of the Holy Prophet s.a.w. That same year a touring preacher named John Henry Barrows announced that Christian theology could now anticipate conquering the entire Muslim world. Having made this bold claim, he went on to elaborate with the announcement ‘Christ, in the person of his disciples, shall enter the ka’bah of Mecca.’
With such abuse of The Holy Prophet s.a.w. showing no signs of abating, Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was left with no choice. He was compelled to defend his master, The Holy Prophet s.a.w. and the Muslim world itself. He desired to illustrate to the Christian mob of India how hurtful and barbaric their style of attack had become and, indeed, the fallacy of their own arguments. However, he absolutely could not resort to defaming the beautiful character of the prophet Jesus a.s. that we find in the Holy Quran. So, instead he decided to point out the vile lies that the Christians themselves have spread about the character Jesus contained within The Bible, whom they believe to be a son of God.
Jesus a.s. in the Bible of the Christians
For those of you who may not be familiar with the Bible, according to this text of the Christians Jesus is not only the son of God, but someone who kept a prostitute named Mary Magdelane as one of his closest friends. He also drank wine and there are various accounts of him lying to his own disciples, as well as commiting many other sins. So, whilst maintaining his utmost respect for the real prophet Jesus a.s. who is mentioned in the Holy Quran, Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad would respond to Christian attacks on the character and person of The Holy Prophet of Islam s.a.w. by pointing out the sheer fallacy of describing the biblical character Jesus as a son of God.
The non-Ahmadi Muslim scholars and leaders of India supported Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s defence of the Holy Prophet s.a.w.
This method of response was not exclusive to Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad. In fact many non-Ahmadi Muslim scholars and leaders of the same Indian period followed his lead. Maulawi Rahmatullah Muhajir Mecci was a learned scholar of the Sunni Muslims. In his book Izalah Auham he writes, ‘Jesus was accompanied in his journeys by several women who used to provide for him out of their earnings; prostitutes used to kiss his feet; Martha and Mary (Magdalene) were his friends; and he drank wine and offered it to others.” Maulawi Rahmatullah did not actually believe these things about the Jesus a.s. of the Holy Quran, but was pointing out to Christians how crude their tactic of spreading lies about the Holy Prophet s.a.w. was and that the characterised ‘son of God’ had, according to their own Bible, a long list of personal flaws.
In the same manner, the scholar Maulwi Ale-Hassan, of the Ahle Sunnah sect, wrote in his book Istifsar, ‘The religion and faith of them (Christians of this period of India) is that God, having become a foetus in the womb of Mary, nourished himself for months with menstrual blood; then he grew into a shapeless lump from the clot of blood, later, from this shapeless lump, he grew into flesh & bones. Then he came out of her vaginal tract, excreted urine and faeces. On becoming of age he became a disciple of his own servant (i.e. that of John the Baptist) and at the end he remained in hell for three days having been cursed by God.’ Once again, Maulwi Ale-Hassan was not trying to insult the real prophet of God, Jesus a.s. but to show the Christians how disgusting their own tactic of using foul language about religious personalities was. We could go on and on giving dozens of such examples written by respected, Indian, non-Ahmadi Muslim scholars of the same period about the biblical character Jesus, but we feel we have made our point.
Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s own response to the very same allegation
Faced with this appropriate response, soon the Christians themselves became offended at the attacks on the character named Jesus from their own altered scriptures. They made the exact same accusations against Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s that are being repeated on anti-Ahmadiyya websites today. What could we be fairer than to here present a refutation from Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s own writings?
“You say that I have, as if, insulted Hadhrat Masih (the Messiah) to some extent by using an abusive word with reference to him. This is a misunderstanding of yours. I believe Hadhrat Masih to be a true prophet, a chosen one and beloved servant of God. What I said in retaliation was in keeping with your own faith. Hence, it is you, not me, who stand accused of the accusation that you level at me.” (Jang-e-Muqaddas Page 88, Ruhani Khaza’in, Vol. 6, page 170)
“When we are deeply hurt and unjustified attacks of all kinds are made on our Holy Prophet s.a.w., only then, as a warning, we retaliate in kind on the basis of their (Christians’) own authentic books. They aught to point out in my writings any thing which I have written as a retaliatory response and it is not found in the Gospels. After all it is not possible for me, that on hearing the insult of the Holy Prophet s.a.w. I remain silent.” (Malfuzat, Vol. 9, page 479, edition 1961)
“Everywhere in my writing I (referring to Christ) have meant the suppostitious Jesus of Christians. ‘Isaas bin Maryam, who was a prophet of God and who is mentioned in the Holy Qur’an is certainly never intended in my harsh comments and let it be remembered that if in future any (Christian) padre, shunning the ways of abuse, speaks politely, I, too, shall be polite with him. At present they themselves are responsible for the attacks on their Jesus for under no circumstances they refrain from abuse and vituperation.” (Nur-ul-Qur’an, Part 2, Ruhani Khaza’in, Vol. 9, page 375)
“The readers should keep it in mind that with reference to Christian religion it was necessary for me to argue in the same manner as they (the Christians) adopt in confrontation with us. In fact, Christians do not believe in that ‘Isaas of ours who claimed about himself that he was only a servant (of God) and a prophet, acknowledged that earlier prophets were righteous and sincerely and truly prophesied about the advent of the Holy Prophet s.a.w. Rather they believe in a man by the name of Jesus of whom there is no mention in the Qur’an and say that that person claimed to be God and called earlier prophets robbers etc. They also say that this man was a staunch disbeliever of our Holy Prophet s.a.w. and that he prophesied that he would be followed only by false claimants. And you know very well that the glorious Qur’an has not taught us to believe in such a man. Rather the Qur’an, with reference to such people, has categorically stated that if anyone, being a human, claims to be God, God will throw him into hell. It is for this reason that whenever I have mentioned the Jesus of Christians I have not observed such reverence for him as one should observe with respect to truthful and righteous person. Were such a man not blind, he would never have said that he would be followed only by false claimants; and were he pious and faithful, he would not have claimed to be God. The readers (of my writings) should keep it in mind that some harsh words that I have used do not apply to Hadhrat ‘Isaas. On the contrary they are used for Jesus of whom we find no mention whatsoever in the Qur’an or Hadith.” (Majmu‘ah Ishtiharat, Vol. 2, pp. 295, 296)
From his own writings, it is completely clear that Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was only speaking in this harsh manner as a retaliatory defence of The Holy Prophet s.a.w. He was also not insulting the Quranic prophet Jesus a.s. (whom he referred to with the Arabic version of his name found in the Quran, Isaa, whilst referring to the distorted BIblical ‘son of God’ as Jesus Christ). He was referring to flawed character Jesus, who we find in The Holy Bible. This Bible had been so tampered with that it now contains a character portrayal which was wholly dissimilar to the true, real life prophet Jesus of the Holy Quran and it was this mockery of a character against whom Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and his Muslim contemporaries wrote.
Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s true beliefs on the Quranic prophet of God, Jesus a.s.
If anyone is left in any doubt about the true beliefs of Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad concerning the real life prophet Jesus a.s., who we find in The Holy Quran, let them examine this one final passage which we will paste below.
“Hadrat ‘Isa is an exalted Prophet of God. Without any doubt, ‘Isa the Messiah a.s. is a beloved of God, a Chosen one, Light for the world, a Sun of guidance, a dear one to God, placed closed to His Throne. Millions of people who love him truly and follow his exhortations correctly shall be saved from hell.” (Damimah Risalah Government Angrezi Aur Jihad, p. 4. Ruhani Khaza’in, Vol. 17)
True meaning of Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s writings
In light of all of this evidence, the intent of the passage quoted at the top of this page becomes clear; one of the allegations Christians of the period we are discussing and many academics have since made is to accuse The Holy Prophet s.a.w. of plagiarising stories from The Holy Bible in The Holy Quran. Here, Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad highlights how Jesus a.s. could just as easily be accused, from the accounts of The Holy Bible itself, of plagiarising the teachings of The Old Testament (or Jewish Bible).
@ MUSLIM
Your copy/paste spent all the time beating around bush to show how the following quote is misquoted….I read your whole reply….it neither provided context; nor provided explanation of how the following is mis-quoted….all it does is starts to talk about totally irrelevant stuff.
“It is extremely shameful that the Sermon of the Mount, which forms the core of the New Testament was plagiarised by Jesus from the Jewish book, The Talmud, and then he pretended as if it were his own teachings. But since the time this plagiarism has been discovered, the Christians have been suffering a great shame. Jesus committed this act (of forgery) to perhaps gain influence by presenting some good teachings. (Zamima Anjam-e-Atham, Roohani Khazain vol 11 p.290)
Also, having read your whole reply…yes that’s what we do here….investigate…..(So its a wrong place to copy/paste stupid stuff from your cult run literature) and people on this blog are actually familiar with both the Bible and our Glorious Qur’an very thoroughly. So the lies and tricks do not work here.
You wrote in the response to the above quote (copy/pasted):
“For those of you who may not be familiar with the Bible, according to this text of the Christians Jesus is not only the son of God, but someone who kept a prostitute named Mary Magdelane as one of his closest friends. He also drank wine and there are various accounts of him lying to his own disciples, as well as commiting many other sins. So, whilst maintaining his utmost respect for the real prophet Jesus a.s. who is mentioned in the Holy Quran, Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad would respond to Christian …………… “
NO where in the Bible, Mary Magdelane is a prostitute. When did Jesus lie to his disciples and committed many other sin according to the Bible? Even according to Bible, Jesus was sinless. This plus so many other things you wrote regarding Biblical stories are completely imaginary…..This is what you guys do…..mix truth with falsehood. I want everyone to read this so I will keep it short and leave it here.
Enough with tricks/imaginary stories and weird logic that even child knows is fallacious. IF YOU ARE TRUTHFUL; COME TO DEBATE IF MIRZA WAS A PROPHET OR IMPOSTER.
@ k
Regarding the grave location is Ir-relevent. the important thing is that Holy Quran clearly shows with 30 verses that Jesus(as) died just like any other prophet and there is not a single verse in Holy Quran that proves that Jesus (as) went to the SKY with this physical body.
You are tried your best but you won’t be able to produce a single verse from Holy Quran that shows Jesus(as) went to the SKY with his PHYSICAL BODY. not a single verse.
you quoted several referenced from the books or mirza sahib regarding the location of the grave can you please please provide 1 verse from HOLY QURAN that proves Hadrat ISSA (as) went to the sky alive with his body … just 1 verse…
But here are 30 verses of Holy Quran that shows Jesus died just like all other prophets.
http://deathofjesus30.blogspot.ca/2012/05/30-verses-from-holy-quran-that-proves.html
and here are more on this link.
http://deathofjesus30.blogspot.ca/
Nothing in the Holy Quran proves that Hazrat Isa a s. died. Now the grave of Hazrat Isa a.s. as foretold by Mirza in 3 different places is not relevant to you, because Mirza was caught pants down lying. Liar liar pants on fire. I am watching with amazement your language and accusations against Muslims and their scholars when clear evidence has been provided to you. It appears that facts are irrelevant for you Ahmadis as you always believe in falsehood.
@K
by just saying nothing proves in the Holy Quran is your attempt to escape. I quoted 30 verses and any wise person can see that all those clearly proves that Jesus(as) or Essa(as) passed away just like all other prophets, but you were not able to produce a single verse to support your claim.
I again ask you to just produce 1 verse from the Holy Quran that proves that Jesus(as) was raised to the SKY with his Physical body. Just 1 verse instead of deviating the topic to somewhere else.
If Jesus(as) is alive then there must be 1 verse to prove his life. Ask your imam sheharyar to help you in getting 1 verse if he knows any verse from Holy Quran.
Mr. Ahmadi,
What is the proof that he died naturally and lived till age 120 years. This is just another false theory floated by the Mirza. It does not make any sense that he lived at some other place for 120 years and abandoned his mission in the holy lands. By the way I noticed how conveniently you ignored to answer the point about the three different places of burial of Jesus p.b.u.h given by Mirza. This and many other such claims by Mirza are proof of his fabrications and lies. So you basically want us to blindly follow Mirza as Imam of the Age and his contradictory teachings. When we question, then again it will be you who will tell us what to believe and what to ignore. Looks like you want to have the cake and eat it too. No no this is not going to work. We are not blind nauzobillah and we see that there are major flaws in Ahmadiyya claims and we are not going to fall in this trap InshaAllah.
What i have learned so far from discussion with you and other Ahmadis is following:
You,
1) Keep denying the facts given to you
2) Never admit Mirza’s lies
3) Keep arguing to defend Mirza, even if there is no proof
4) Blame Muslims as
Consider the Hadith :
“Aisha (God be pleased with her) said that, in his illness in which he died, the Holy Prophet said: ‘Every year Gabriel used to repeat the Holy Quran with me once, but this year he has done it twice. He has informed me that there is no prophet but he lives half as long as the one who preceded him. And he has told me that Jesus lived a hundred and twenty years, and I see that I am about to leave this world at sixty’.”
(Hujjaj al-Kiramah, p. 428; Kanz al-Ummal, vol. 6, p. 160, from Hazrat Fatima; and Mawahib al-Ladinya, vol. 1, p. 42)
There is another Hadith I think which gives an age of 125. At what age a prophet dies is irrelevant to ones faith. What matters is he died like any prophet. Why r u so interested where he died, and when? Can you list the deaths of all 124000 prophets? If so then have the courage to ask.
As far as where he diedhe died in Kashmir, this was revealed to the promised Messiah (as), the other places were (in my limited knowledge, unless someone can correct me) were speculations. A prophet is a human, hence he can speculate.
Why he went to kasmir because from the ten tribes of Israel were spread to as far as kawhmir and offcourse we all know that he came for the whole 12 tribes. That’s a summary a lot more info in alislam (dot) org
So based on the Hadith you have quoted the age of your nabi Mirza should have been around 30 years. Do you know at what age Mirza died?
I CAN SEE THE ANGER OF SOME AHMADIS AND THEY COMMENTS WHEN THEY ARE UNABLE TO DEFEND THE LIAR MIRZA AGAINST CONCRETE EVIDENCE FROM THEIR OWN BOOKS. Anger and hurling accusations will not solve the problem. Only open mind and understanding of the reality with supplication to Almighty for guidance is the only way.
According to Islam, Jesus never died on the cross, nor ever wanted to die on the cross, nor ever was born to die on the cross. Muslims believe that Jesus was sentenced to death, and people thought that he got executed on the cross. The Holy Quran rejects this idea, and claims that it is a false one. Jesus never died on the cross, nor he ever died for anyone’s sins. Let us look at what the Holy Quran (The Muslims Holy Scripture) says about this issue:
Let’s look at verse 4:156-159 “That they rejected Faith; That they uttered against Mary A grave false charge; That they said (in boast): ‘We killed Christ Jesus The son of Mary, The Messenger of Allah.’ But they killed him not, Nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not. Nay, Allah raised him up Unto Himself; and Allah Is Exalted in Power, Wise. And there is none of the people of the book (Jews and Christians) But must believe in him (Jesus) Before his death; And on the Day of Judgment He (Jesus) will be a witness Against them.”
The false charge against Mary was that she was unchaste. Such a charge is bad enough to make against any woman, but to make it against Mary, the mother of Jesus, was to bring into redicule Allah’s power itself. Islam is specially strong in guarding the reputation of women. Slanderers of women are bound to bring four witnesses in support of their accusation, and if they fail to produce four witnesses, they are be flogged with eighty stripes and debarred forever from being competent witnesses.
Let us look at verse 24:4 “And those who launch A charge against chaste women, And produce not four witnesses (To support their allegations) Flog them with eighty stripes; And reject their evidence Ever after: for such men Are wicked transgressors. Unless they repent thereafter And mend (their conduct); For Allah is Oft-Forgiving Most Merciful.” Here we see in this Holy Verse how much Allah Almighty cares about not criticizing women unless we are absolutely sure about it and we can provide at least 4 witnesses to support our allegation.
MIRZA WAS A WICKED TRANSGRESSOR, WHO LIED ABOUT THE DEATH OF JESUS pbuh, PLACE OF BURIAL and made false charges against his pious mother MARYAM p.b.u.h, ACCORDING TO HOLY QURAN. YOU AHMADIS SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF FOLLOWING SUCH A PERSON INSTEAD YOU ARE PROMOTING HIM AS “IMAM OF THE AGE” What kind of mentally challenged people are you?
so in your quotation from 4:156-159
which arabic words stands for SKY and PHYSICAL BODY ?
@Ahmadi,
Pay attention to this Quran statement, it is self explanatory: You asked for single I have given you one. Now be an honest man and read it with open mind not with the twisted vision of Mirza’s eye glasses. Secondly, how convenient that you completely ignore Mirza’s charade against the holy Pophet Jesus a.s. and Muhammad (pbuh) why are you running away looks like once again you have no answer except beating around the bush? No prophet of Allah s.w.t ever abuses another one. So do you still believe Mirza was a Prophet?
Let’s look at verse 4:156-159 “That they rejected Faith; That they uttered against Mary A grave false charge; That they said (in boast): ‘We killed Christ Jesus The son of Mary, The Messenger of Allah.’ But they killed him not, Nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not. Nay, Allah raised him up Unto Himself; and Allah Is Exalted in Power, Wise. And there is none of the people of the book (Jews and Christians) But must believe in him (Jesus) Before his death; And on the Day of Judgment He (Jesus) will be a witness Against them.”
@k read my response below
First point: verse 4:156-159 is clearly referring to the crucifixion incident. So if Hadhrat Isa (as) was not killed or crucified as a result of the process of crucifixion, then this exactly what the Qur’an is saying. The Qur’an is not saying that he (as) did not die later. Just to illustrate: If there was an attempted murder on someone by say knife and he was saved somehow, that means that he did not die of attempted murder but that does not mean he never died. Hence to see whether Hadhrat Isa (as) has died or not we have to look at other verses.
Second point: The translated word “raised up” refers to the raising of the spiritual status of Hadhrat Isa (as) and not physical because for one thing Allah is everywhere, so to raise towards Allah, were the meaning taken literally would mean that Hadhrat Isa (as) did not move an inch. Second let me give a commonly recited prayer by Muslims:
allähummaghfirlï warhamnï wahdinï wa ‘äfinï warfa‘nï wajburnï warzuqnï
Meaning: ” O Allah, forgive me, and have mercy on me, and guide me, and grant me security, and raise me up, and make good for me my shortcoming, and provide for me.”
The same word “rafa” used in the Quran is used here to mean “raise up”. It would be a little peculiar to pray for the literal ascendence, maybe for you to then descend 2000 years from now? Clearly this prayer is for the raising up of the spiritual status of man. Hence the case with the Quranic verse cited above.
Now to see which verses show death of Hadhrat Isa(as):
” And Muhammad is no more than an apostle; the apostles have already passed away before him; if then he dies or is killed will you turn back upon your heels? And whoever turns back upon his heels, he will by no means do harm to Allah in the least and Allah will reward the grateful.” (3:144)
It’s clear from this verse that all Prophets before Hadhrat Muhammad (sa) have passed away. Had only some prophets passed away, then taking into consideration that Hadhrat Muhammad (sa) is at apex spiritual evolution, the father of all Prophets this argument as presented by the Quran would become weak: all Prophets before Hadhrat Muhammad (sa) have died and it is therefore pertinent that Hadhrat Muhammad (sa) must one day pass away too. Had some prophets not died away, then the immediate question arises why should the greatest of all Prophets die? Indeed this verse was the very verse recited by Abu Bakr (ra) on the demise of the greatest of all prophets. Companions such as Hadhrat Umar (ra) were not ready to believe his death until the very recitation of the verse. Everyone accepted his (sa) death, not one raised the question, Hadhrat Isa (as) is alive but the Seal of the Prophets, the spiritual father of all Prophets is dead?
@ Muslim
great reply. May Allah bless you.
@ So called “Muslim”
Qadiani Changes to the Translation of the Holy Quran
In an attempt to give their cult an appearance of validity and misguide uninformed individuals, the Qadiani (Ahmadiyya) leadership has tampered with authentic meaning and interpretation of the Holy Quran, as related to us by Prophet Muhammad(SAW). They promote an incorrect translation of the Holy Quran written to support the blasphemous claims of Mirza Ghulam Qadiani, the founder of the Qadiani (Ahmadiyya) Movement.
There is among them a section who distort the Book with their tongues: (As they read) you would think it is a part of the Book, but it is no part of the Book; and they say, “That is from Allah,” but it is not from Allah: It is they who tell a lie against Allah, and (well) they know it!
(The Holy Quran Al-E-Imran 3:78)
In these pages we will, by the leave of Allah(SWT), expose the hypocrisy and absurdity of their ways. The Qadiani (Ahmadiyya ) translation of the Quran we refer to is the one completed by Malik Ghulam Farid, under the auspices of Mirza Tahir Ahmad Qadiani, the current leader of the movement. [The Cover Page of the Qadiani Fake Translation of Quran we refer to].
The Holy Quran, Al-Baqara 2:4.
Two authoritative and authentic translations of this Ayah follow:
And who believe in the Revelation sent to thee, and sent before thy time, and (in their hearts) have the assurance of the Hereafter.
(Yusuf Ali Translation)
And who believe in that which is revealed unto thee (Muhammad) and that which was revealed before thee, and are certain of the Hereafter.
(Pickthal Translation)
In the footnote of their Translation of this Ayah, Qadianis have sneaked in an interpretation that has no foundation in the Holy Quran or any of the authentic Hadith of the Prophet(SAW). They claim that the Holy Quran tells us of two advent of the Prophet Muhammad(SAW):
First one took place in the person of Hazrat Muhammad(SAW) of Arabia in 7th century of Christian era;
The second (reincarnation) took place some 1300 years later in the person of Mirza Ghulam Qadiani, the founder of Qadiani (Ahmadiyya Cult)!
[Read: Qadiani Fake Translation of Quran 2:5]
Apparently, Qadiani leadership hopes to trick uninformed individuals into believing that theirs invention has a foothole in traditional Islamic teaching! To the contrary, Muslims are ordered (as an article of faith) to believe that Prophet Muhammad(SAW) of Arabia is the last of the prophets and the Holy Quran is the last of the revelations. Islam categorically rejects the concept of reincarnation of the dead. In this light, do you believe Qadianis (Ahmadis) have any legitimate basis for even suggesting such an outlandish idea? [Read: A Proof of the Finality of Prophethood]
The Holy Quran, As-Saff 61:6
Two authoritative and authentic translations of this ayah follow:
And remember, Jesus, the son of Mary, said: “O Children of Israel! I am the messenger of Allah (sent) to you, confirming the Law (which came) before me, and giving Glad Tidings of a Messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmad.” But when he came to them with Clear Signs, they said, “this is evident sorcery!”
(Yusuf Ali Translation)
And when Jesus son of Mary said: O Children of Israel! Lo! I am the messenger of Allah unto you, confirming that which was (revealed) before me in the Torah, and bringing good tidings of a messenger who cometh after me, whose name is the Praised One. Yet when he hath come unto them with clear proofs, they say: This is mere magic.
(Pickthal Translation)
[Comment: the name Ahmad means “Praised One” in Greek]
Qadianis claim that this Ayah was revealed to prophesy the arrival of Mirza Ghulam-Ahmad Qadiani and not the prophet Muhammad(SWT)!
Obviously, they are hoping that the individuals reading this claim are unfamiliar with the historic fact that Prophet(SWT) was named both Muhammad and Ahmad at birth and that he was the prophet who followed Jesus(pbuh) (as foretold in this verse). Additionally, the Islamic doctrine of the Finality of Prophethood and authentic Hadith of the prophet Muhammad(SWT) all confirm the fact that Mirza Ghulam’s claim was a form of disbelief.
Finally, Mirza Ghulam’s name was not Ahmad, as Qadiani leaders would like their victims to believe; his name was Ghulam-Ahmad, meaning the “Servant of Ahmad”. Isn’t it a pity that Qadianis (Ahmadiyya) are trying to displace the real Master with the servant through these false claims?
Let’s look at one Authentic Hadith of the Prophet Muhammad(SWT) which should suffice to convince all sincere Muslims who the Ahmad mentioned in the Quran is:
I am Muhammad, I am Ahmad, I am the effacer and infidelity shall be erased through me; I am the assembler. People shall be assembled on Doomsday after my time. And I am the last in the sense that no prophet shall succeed me.
(Bukhari, Muslim, Tirmidhi, Muatta’)
The Holy Quran, Al-Imran 3:54-55.
Two authoritative and authentic translations of these ayat follow:
And (the unbelievers) plotted and planned, and Allah too planned, and the best of planners is Allah.
Behold! Allah said: “O Jesus! I will take thee and raise thee to Myself and clear thee (of the falsehoods) of those who blaspheme; I will make those who follow thee superior to those who reject faith, to the Day of Resurrection: Then shall ye all return unto me, and I will judge between you of the matters wherein ye dispute.
(Yusuf Ali Translation)
And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers.
(And remember) when Allah said: O Jesus! Lo! I am gathering thee and causing thee to ascend unto Me, and am cleansing thee of those who disbelieve and am setting those who follow thee above those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then unto Me ye will (all) return, and I shall judge between you as to that wherein ye used to differ.
(Pickthal Translation)
Qadianis (Ahmadiyya) claim that the interpretation of these verses, as taught to us by prophet Muhammad(SAW), is false! They insist that since Mirza Ghulam Qadiani also claimed to be the Promised Messiah, the prophet Jesus(pbuh) must have died (ignoring ayah 5:117 telling us “Allah raised Jesus to himself”)! They claim that Jesus(pbuh) was crucified (ignoring ayah 4:157 telling us “nor crucified him”) but that he was not dead when he was lowered from the crucifix. When Jesus(pbuh) recovered, Qadiani leaders claim, he escaped to Kashmir, India, where he lived for some 86 years in peace, died, and is buried.
[Read: Qadiani Fake Translation of Quran 3:55-56]
Naturally, Qadianis can not explain why neither Quran nor Hadith of the Prophet(SAW) ever put forth this idea or mentioned Kashmir as the living and burial place of Jesus(pbuh). On the contrary, every authentic Hadith of the Prophet(SAW) teaches us that Jesus(pbuh) was raised to heaven and will descend, in the company of Angels, as the promised Messiah. In fact, these same hadith negate the false claim of Mirza Ghulam Qadiani, who was born to an Indian couple and did not descend from heavens.
More importantly, perhaps, Qadiani leaders can explain to us why there are no dependable historical evidence of Jesus(pbuh) having lived in Kashmir! This great Prophet of God had a profound effect on humanity by preaching for only three years in Jerusalem. How come after eighty six years of peaceful preaching, as Qadianis claim, a similar effect did not develop in Kashmir? Did Jesus(pbuh) retire in Kashmir and somehow, unlike all other great Prophets(pbut) of Allah(SWT), did not live and die preaching Islam? Obviously, their conjecture in this regard is absurd and without any merit.
The Holy Quran, An-Nisa 4:157-158.
Two authoritative and authentic translations of these ayat follow:
That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah”;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:- Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;-
(Yusuf Ali Translation)
And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger – they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain. But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.
(Pickthal Translation)
The conjecture Qadiani (Ahmadiyya) leadership are advancing with regard to this verse is that Jesus(pbuh) was crucified by the Jews, but that he did not die on the cross; he died later from natural causes in Kashmir! It should be obvious that Mirza Ghulam Qadiani needed to advance this baseless claim to declare himself the promised Messiah; to this end, he shamelessly resorted to changing the meaning of the Holy Quran and rejecting hundred of authentic hadith of the Prophet(SAW).
The Holy Quran, Al-Maeda 5:117.
Two authoritative and authentic translations of this ayah follow:
“Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say, to wit, ‘worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord’; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me up Thou wast the Watcher over them, and Thou art a witness to all things.”
(Yusuf Ali Translation)
“I spake unto them only that which Thou commandedst me, (saying): Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. I was a witness of them while I dwelt among them, and when Thou tookest me Thou wast the Watcher over them. Thou art Witness over all things.”
(Pickthal Translation)
Qadianis (Ahmadis) translate the phrase “Thou didst take me up” as “Thou didst cause me to die” to support their baseless doctrine regarding Jesus(pbuh)’s death and burial in Kashmir. Obviously, they do not know all the Authentic Hadith of the Prophet(SAW) about Jesus(pbuh) returning as the Messiah before the day of Judgment, establishing Islam on earth, and ruling for forty years before dying. Jesus(pbuh) will indeed return, rule, and then die. After his death, Allah(SWT) will watch over the people, until the day of Judgement. When Jesus(pbuh) and the rest of the humanity are risen from the grave (the day of Judgement), Jesus(pbuh), like all other Prophets(pbut), will be asked to bear witness against his followers and he will testify as foretold in this verse.
The following verse of the Holy Quran supports this Islamic doctrine:
And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him [Jesus] before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;-
(The Holy Quran; An-Nisa 4:159)
Every Christian and Jew will come to accept Islamic view of Jesus(pbuh) when Jesus(pbuh), himself, descends from the heavens, brings peace, and rules the world. They all will believe this before “his [Jesus’] death”. This verse is very clear in supporting the idea that Jesus(pbuh) has not yet died, since not all people of the book believe in his true mission and message.
Mirza Ghulam Qadiani claimed that the following verse revealed in the Holy Quran to prophet Muhammad(SAW) were revealed and intended for him and not the prophet Muhammad(SAW)! We have followed each verse with a reference to Qadiani (Ahmadiyya) book where the claim is made:
The Holy Quran, Aal-Imran 3:31.
Say: “If ye do love Allah, Follow me: Allah will love you and forgive you your sins: For Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.”
(Claim made in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 82)
The Holy Quran, Al-A’raf 7:158.
Say: “O men! I am sent unto you all, as the Messenger of Allah, to Whom belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth: there is no god but He: it is He That giveth both life and death. So believe in Allah and His Messenger, the Unlettered Prophet, who believeth in Allah and His words: follow him that (so) ye may be guided.”
(Claim in Tadkirah, P. 352, 4th Edition)
The Holy Quran, Al-Anfal 8:17.
It is not ye who slew them; it was Allah: when thou threwest (a handful of dust), it was not thy act, but Allah’s: in order that He might test the Believers by a gracious trial from Himself: for Allah is He Who heareth and knoweth (all things).
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 70)
The Holy Quran, Isra 17.1.
Glory to (Allah) Who did take His servant for a Journey by night from the Sacred Mosque to the farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless,- in order that We might show him some of Our Signs: for He is the One Who heareth and seeth (all things).
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 78)
The Holy Quran, Al-Kahf l8:110.
Say: “I am but a man like yourselves, (but) the inspiration has come to me, that your Allah is one Allah: whoever expects to meet his Lord, let him work righteousness, and, in the worship of his Lord, admit no one as partner.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 81)
The Holy Quran, Al-Kahf 18:27.
And recite (and teach) what has been revealed to thee of the Book of thy Lord: none can change His Words, and none wilt thou find as a refuge other than Him.
(Claim in Haqiqat-u1-Wahi, P. 74)
The Holy Quran, Al-Anbiya 21:107.
We sent thee not, but as a Mercy for all creatures.
(Claim in Arbaeen, No. 3, P. 23)
The Holy Quran, Al-Ahzab 33:46.
And as one who invites to Allah’s (grace) by His leave, and as a lamp spreading light.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 75)
The Holy Quran, Ya-Sin 36:1-3.
Ya Sin.
By the Qur’an, full of Wisdom,-
Thou art indeed one of the messengers,
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 107; Tadkirah, P. 479)
The Holy Quran, Al-Fath 48:1.
Verily We have granted thee a manifest Victory,
that Allah may forgive thee of thy faults of the past and the future.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 94)
The Holy Quran, Al-Fath 48:10.
Verily those who plight their fealty to thee do no less than plight their fealty to Allah: the Hand of Allah is over their hands: then any one who violates his oath, does so to the harm of his own soul, and any one who fulfils what he has covenanted with Allah,- Allah will soon grant him a great Reward.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 80)
The Holy Quran, Al-Fath 48:29.
Muhammad is the messenger of Allah; and those who are with him are strong against Unbelievers, (but) compassionate amongst each other…
(Claim in Ek Ghalati ka Izala, P. 3; Tadkirah, P. 94, 4th Edition)
The Holy Quran, An-Najm 53:3-4.
Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire.
It is no less than inspiration sent down to him:
(Claim in Tadkirah, P. 378)
The Holy Quran, An-Najm 53:8-9.
Then he approached and came closer,
And was at a distance of but two bow-lengths or (even) nearer;
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 76)
The Holy Quran, Ar-Rahm.an 55:1-2.
(Allah) Most Gracious!
It is He Who has taught the Qur’an.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 70)
The Holy Quran, As-Saff 61:9.
It is He Who has sent His Messenger with Guidance and the Religion of Truth, that he may proclaim it over all religion, even though the Pagans may detest (it).
(Claim in Tadkirah, P. 387-388, 4th Edition)
The Holy Quran, Al-Muzammil 73:15.
We have sent to you, (O men!) a messenger, to be a witness concerning you, even as We sent a messenger to Pharaoh.
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 101)
The Holy Quran, Al-Kauthar 108:1.
To thee have We granted the Fount (of Abundance).
(Claim in Haqiqat-ul-Wahi, P. 102)
@kopy
Here’s my copy/paste response to your copy paste:
There was a time when the circumstances surrounding the crucifixion of Hadhrat Jesusas was a matter of great debate between Ahmadis and non-Ahmadi Muslims.
Whereas Ahmadi Muslims believe Hadhrat Jesusas was a prophet who died like all other human beings, a great majority of Muslims held the view that Hadhrat Jesusas was taken to Heaven by Allah and a Jesus-look-alike was crucified by the Jews instead.
Few non Ahmadi scholars today like to raise the topic of the death of Hadhrat Jesusas. To most it has become a non issue. They would rather vigorously propound their interpretation of khatam nabiyyin. It has become the “flavor of the month” so to speak. The majority of Muslims appear to be indifferent or just plain uninterested.
A more interesting change in the attitude of Muslim scholars has been in the total abandonment of the belief that Hadhrat Jesusas is alive in Heaven. Only recently I ordered books from the Juma Masjid in Toronto, the largest non-Ahmadi Mosque in Toronto. One book entitled “Myth of the Cross” by Al Hajj Ajijola gave full support to the Ahmadiyya view that Hadhrat Jesusas died a natural death. Similarly, well known Muslim scholars such as Ahmed Deedat back the Ahmadiyya position on Hadhrat Jesusas. Moreover, several commentaries of the Quran from Egypt, one of them endorsed by Al Azhar, now interpret the verses regarding the death of Hadhrat Jesusas as Ahmadis do.
A four part series of articles on the death of Hadhrat Jesusas, based on the Quran, the Hadith, and books of history is presented.
The so-called orthodox Muslim belief that a Jesus-look-alike was crucified instead of Hadhrat Jesusas, and that Hadhrat Jesusas was raised to heaven, to descend a later day, has no support in the Holy Quran. The origin of this popular belief is from Christian sources, as will be shown in a future article.
The Quran is quite clear that Hadhrat Jesusas has passed away, and gives no support to the concept of Hadhrat Jesusas physically going to heaven. Some specific verses will now be considered:
“Jesus said, I am a servant of Allah. He has given me the Book and made me a prophet. And He has made me blessed wheresoever I may be and has enjoined on me prayer and alms-giving so long as I live. He has made me dutiful toward my mother, and He has not made me haughty and unblessed. Peace was on me the day I was born, and peace there shall be on the day I shall die, and the day I shall be raised up to life again.” (19:31-4)
The verse shows Hadhrat Jesusas must have died, and could not exist in heaven with his physical body:
If he was still alive, he would have to give alms in heaven, but who would need alms there?
If he would descend again to earth alive, he would have to follow the Jewish prescriptions on both prayer and alms-giving – and could not be a follower of Islamic law.
Did his mother accompany him to heaven physically? How could he otherwise behave like a dutiful son towards her?
“Keep in mind when God will say to Jesus, son of Mary: Didst thou say to people: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? – and he will answer, Holy art Thou, I could never say that to which I had no right. If I had said it, Thou wouldst have surely known it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy mind. It is only Thou who art the Knower of hidden things. I said nothing to them except that which Thou didst command me: Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. I was a witness over them as long as I remained among them, but since Thou didst cause me to die, Thou hast been the Watcher over them, and Thou art Witness over all things.” (5:117-8)
The verse proves that:
The corruption of Christian doctrine took place after the death of Hadhrat Jesusas. If Hadhrat Jesusas is still alive, as some Muslims believe, then Christianity must still be pure.
The same Hadhrat Jesusas will not appear a second time in this world, as he would then become aware that Christians had now taken his mother as Divine, and could not, therefore plead ignorance in front of God’s judgment seat.
The Quran says about persons or beings worshiped as God: “They are dead, not living; and they know not when they will be raised.” (16:21)
If Hadhrat Jesusas is alive, as some Muslims believe, he must be God
The notion that Hadhrat Jesusas floated into the sky towards God is an Un-Quranic concept. Before going into the specific verses which refute this popular belief, it should be noted that Heaven is a spiritual state which our souls experience AFTER death. It is not a physical location beyond the stratosphere. By climbing Mount Everest, we do not come closer to God!
Humans, according to the Quran, must live and die in the physical universe.
“And for you there is an abode on the earth and a provision for a time, He said, therein shall you live and therein shall you die and therefrom shall you be brought forth.” ( 7:25-6)
“Have we not made the earth so as to hold the living and the dead?” (77:26-7)
On one occasion the enemies of the Holy Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, challenged him that they will not believe in him unless he “ascend up into heaven” and “send down to us a Book.” (17:93) The Holy Prophetsaw replied: “Holy is my Lord! I am but a mortal sent as a messenger.” (17:93)
Thus the Prophets, like all humans, lived and died on the earth. If Jesus is alive today, he must be more than a mortal.
IF ANY HUMAN BEING WAS ABLE TO GO TO HEAVEN WITH HIS PHYSICAL BODY THEN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN OUR BELOVED HOLY PROPHET MUHAMMADsaw, THE GREATEST OF ALL PROPHETS. But the verses above indicate that since he is but a man, it is not possible.
“I will cause you to die”
An important verse is the following:
“When Allah said, O Jesus, I will cause you to die and will raise you to myself, and will clear thee of those who disbelieve, and will place those who follow thee above those who disbelieve, until the Day of Resurrection, then to Me shall be your return and I will judge between you concerning that wherein you differ.” (3:56)
The verse clearly indicates that Hadhrat Jesusas was to die a natural death and then only would he be raised to Allah. The verse does not say that Hadhrat Jesusas will be raised first then will die.
An important word used in the Quran is mutawaffi, derived from tawaffa. When God is the subject and a human is the object, tawaffa means to take away the soul, i.e, death.
Zamakhshari (467-538 A.H), an Arab linguist of great repute says, “Mutawaffika means, I will protect you from being killed by the people and will grant you full lease of life ordained for you, and will cause you to die a natural death not being killed (Kashshaf).” Scholars and commentators like Hazrat Ibn Abbas, Imam Malik, Imam Bukhari, Imam ibn Hazm, Imam ibn Qayyin, Qatadah, Wahhab and others are of the same view.
Note that the same word Tawaffa, has been used in other places in the Quran to indicate death. For example, 2:235: “and those of you who die (yatawaffou-na) and leave wives behind, these wives shall wait concerning themselves for four months and ten days.”
Another important word is rafaa, which means raising, elevating, lifting, exaltation, honor. When the rafaa of a man is spoken of as being towards Allah, the meaning is invariably spiritual elevation and exaltation. For example the Quran says about Prophet Enoch: “We exalted him to a lofty station (19:58).”
A commentary of the Quran by Ibn Khatib (“modern” Egyptian Commentary) summarizes: “And those who assert that Jesus is dead, point to the word of the exalted God: every soul shall taste death, and Jesus, peace be upon him belonged to the human species for which death is ordained. Some people presume that he is dead, and lies buried in a locality which they mention by name, and may be it is India, and God – may He be exalted – knows best what He has said and done.”
The Crucifixion
The verse that refers to the crucifixion is 4:158,159:
“And for their saying, We did slay the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah; whereas they slew him not, nor did they bring about his death upon the cross, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no certain knowledge thereof, but pursue only a conjecture; and they did not arrive at a certainty concerning it. On the contrary, Allah exalted him to himself. And Allah is Mighty, Wise.”
The argument of the Jews was that because Hadhrat Jesusas died on the cross, considered an accursed death according to the law of the Torah, Hadhrat Jesusas could not be a true prophet. The Quran rejects the slaying of Hadhrat Jesusas in any form, including killing by nailing to the cross. Nothing in the verse suggests Hadhrat Jesusas was NOT nailed to the cross: the verse only denies DEATH by nailing to the cross.
The words “Shubbi-ha la hum” means “he made it or him to be like it or him”, or “dubious.” The question arises, who is the person who was made to appear “like one crucified.” Clearly it was Hadhrat Jesusas whom the Jews tried to crucify or slay. The theory invented by some Muslim commentators that someone else was made to look like Hadhrat Jesusas and was then crucified in his place, is simply absurd. The context of the verse cannot be twisted to make room for someone else. No one else is mentioned. Besides, the belief that God made someone else, an innocent person, look like Hadhrat Jesusas, and die in his place, makes God look very cruel.
As shown here in this future article, the belief of a Jesus-look-alike dying on the cross instead of Hadhrat Jesusas has its origin in Christianity, and came into Islamic belief through conversion of Christians to Muslims.
So the Quran is clear that Hadhrat Jesusas only appeared to be crucified, and in fact the Jews were in a state of doubt.
The last portion quoted above refers to rafaa, spiritual exaltation. The plan of the Jews to make Hadhrat Jesusas appear accursed by making him die the accursed death of crucifixion failed, and on the contrary, Hadhrat Jesusas survived the crucifixion. In the sight of Allah, Hadhrat Jesusas was not accursed.
In summary, according to the Quran, humans live and die in the physical universe. Prophets are human beings. Prophets, like all humans, are subject to hunger, pain, death, etc. The Quran is clear that Hadhrat Jesusas was a human being like the Holy Prophet Muhammadsaw. To say that Hadhrat Jesusas is alive today, 2000 years after he was born, is to make him more than a human. The Laws of God do not change. In fact, the Quran makes a general statement: “But you will never find any change in the way of Allah, nor will you find any alteration in the way of Allah.” (35:44)
he death of Hadhrat Jesusas in Islamic Christology is a complex and controversial subject. In some Islamic circles, the crucifixion of Hadhrat Jesusas was denied altogether. Instead, according to some Muslim scholars, Allah miraculously transformed a disciple of Hadhrat Jesusas into the physical image of Hadhrat Jesusas, and the Jews crucified the disciple, thinking him to be Hadhrat Jesusas. This concept may be called the “Substitution theory.” Hadhrat Jesusas, having been saved from such suffering and death, ascended to God in Heaven.
As mentioned in the previous articles, the substitution theory and eventual physical ascension of Hadhrat Jesusas is not substantiated by the Quran and Hadith. Rather, the Quran and Hadith is clear that Hadhrat Jesusas died a natural death. However, the theory of substitution has figured prominently in Islamic tafsir literature. The purpose of this final part is to explain how the substitution theory was introduced into Islam. I will show that the belief of Hadhrat Jesusas not being nailed to the cross and a Jesus-look-alike replacing him was introduced into Islam from the teachings of certain Gnostic Christian sects. These teachings were brought into Islam through conversion of the “People of the Book.”
1. Different Versions of Substitution Story in Islamic Literature.
The belief that someone substituted for Hadhrat Jesusas on the cross has been mentioned by various Muslim commentators of the Quran over the past centuries. Most of the traditions relating the details of the story of Hadhrat Jesusas are told on the authority of Jewish or un-named Christian converts (reference: “Towards an Islamic Christology: The Death of Jesus, Reality or Delusion” in The Muslim World vol 70, No. 2, page 96). The commentary of Tabari (d. 923 A.D) relates on the authority of Wahb (a Jewish convert) that when the Jews were seeking Hadhrat Jesusas to crucify him, God cast the likeness of Hadhrat Jesusas on seventeen disciples. The Jews threatened to kill them all, but instead took just one in the group and killed him, believing him to be Hadhrat Jesusas.
In the next stage of development of the substitution theory, one of the disciples of Hadhrat Jesusas voluntarily accepts to die on the cross for the purpose of saving his master. Such a story may have originated to avoid a major problem associated with the idea of substitution: WHY WOULD GOD FORCE AN INNOCENT PERSON TO SUFFER AND DIE TO SAVE ANOTHER? Tabari relates on the authority of Qatada: “It has been related to us that Jesus, son of Mary, the prophet of God, said to his companions, Who among you would consent to have my likeness cast upon him, and be killed? One of them answered, I would, O Prophet of God. Thus that man was killed and God protected His Prophet and took him up to Himself.” A similar account is mentioned in the traditions of Ibn Ishaq. His source was an unnamed Christian convert. In this story, the person who offered to bear the likeness of Hadhrat Jesusas was not one of the twelve disciples, but a man named Sergus.
In other versions, the miracle of transforming a person into the likeness of Hadhrat Jesusas was a form of Divine punishment for that persons’ persecution and betrayal of Hadhrat Jesusas. For instance, it is said that the enemies of Hadhrat Jesusas sent a man named Tityanus to kill him. However, God foiled the plan by raising Hadhrat Jesusas to Himself and miraculously causing Tityanus to resemble Hadhrat Jesusas. Tityanus was subsequently put to death on the cross by the Jews. BUT, God cast the likeness of Hadhrat Jesusas only on the man’s face and not the body. Thus the people were confused as to the identity of the man killed. This is added to explain the Quranic verse 4:158 which states that those who differed concerning him followed only their conjecture. (reference, The Muslim World same issue as quoted above).
2. Origin of Substitution Theory in Islamic Thought.
The substitution of Hadhrat Jesusas on the cross for someone else has no basis in the Quran or Hadith, as mentioned earlier. This concept likely originated from the influence of Gnostic Christianity on Islam. Several Gnostic Christian sects were known to flourish from the third to the ninth centuries A.D. They were regarded as heretical by the Roman Church. These sects eventually disappeared, both as a result of persecution and gradual conversion of their followers to the fastest growing faith at the time, namely, Islam. Most of the persecution was at the hands of the Roman Church. In the 1940s, documents and writings of these sects were discovered in Egypt, and they became known as the Nag Hammadi documents. These documents are valuable in understanding Gnostic Christian theology.
It is not my purpose here to go into details of Gnosticism. Only the philosophy of docetism will be discussed here. Docetism was a prominent feature of Gnosticism, which held that matter and spirit are antagonistic; matter was considered evil, and spirit considered good and holy. Docetism proposed that Christ only “appeared” to have a real human body, and that Christ only “appeared” to suffer and die on the cross: it was either an illusion or someone else was substituted for him. This tendency to deny or at least diminish the reality of the humanity and suffering of Hadhrat Jesusas was central to the docetic view. It is believed that docetism had its roots in the difficulties some felt in the notion of the Incarnation of God in the person of Christ – it was difficult to associate a Divine-incarnate Son (spirit) with a human being (matter) subject to suffering and death (reference: “Gnosis” by Geddes MacGregor).
A reference from the Nag Hammadi documents demonstrates the docetic view of Hadhrat Jesusas. The book “Apocalypse of Peter” relates a vision of the disciple Peter. He sees Hadhrat Jesusas apparently nailed to the cross and another Jesus floating above the cross. Hadhrat Jesusas explains to Peter: “He whom you see above the tree (cross), glad and laughing, is the living Jesus. But the one whose hands and feet they drive the nails is his fleshy part, which is the substitute…one made in his likeness.” (Reference: “The Laughing Savior”, by John Dart, Page 107).
In summary, the death of Hadhrat Jesusas in Islamic thought has been that of controversy and debate. It is clear that belief in the ascension of Hadhrat Jesusas and death of a Jesus-look-alike did not exist in the original teachings of Islam. The existence of such speculations in the Quranic exegesis appear to have resulted from the influence of certain Gnostic Christian philosophies such as docetism.
You will find a great researched essay by shaikh Umar Subaudar that I have posted today. The essay conclusively proves that Mirza was not a prophet but he was an imposter. If after reading it still you want to stick to quadianism, nobody can help you. We have done our part. Now it is up to you.
@ K
so how does this prove that jesus (as) is alive?
we do believe that he survived crucifixion and then moved out of that area and died naturally at the age of 120 years.
in the verse above Allah says that Jesus(as) was not killed on cross. but if a person is not killed on cross does this mean that person did not die?
this is just a unsuccessful attempt to prove Jesus(as) is alive.
You will find a great researched essay by shaikh Umar Subaudar that I have posted today. The essay conclusively proves that Mirza was not a prophet but he was an imposter. If after reading it still you want to stick to quadianism, nobody can help you. We have done our part. Now it is up to you.
Read the answer above with your own eyes and if you still do not believe in the truth then pray to Allah s.w.t for guidance for guidance only comes from him. Do not shoot the messengers as we only convey the truth to you. We do not repeat things 1000 times like Mirza did with the word “Lanat”. We categorically reject Mirza as a liar and he was never a Prophet, Messiah or Imam Mahdi. If you want to follow him it is your choice. You cannot impose this liar on us. If you follow him as a prophet it is your own decision and it now becomes a separate religion. Your Ansar Raza is not going to help you on the day of Jusdgement. Neither will your Mirza, we leave you with this word of caution as we cannot waste time over and over telling you what is right and wrong. Time is precious and we have done our job.
Please do read my copy/paste response to your copy/paste. Enjoy.
O Non-Muslim Ahmadi under the cover of “Muslim” and your fellow Ahmadis:
What kind of double standards do you have? YOU ACCUSE ME OF COPYING, WHAT ELSE HAVE YOU DONE EXCEPT COPYING RECYCLED STUFF FROM YOU B.S. CLAIMS INCLUDING USELESS VIDEOS TO SLOW DOWN THIS WEB SITE AND WASTED A LOT OF SPACE FOR NOTHING AND TO MISGUIDE INNOCENT PEOPLE. I HAVE READ YOUR CLAIMS BASED ON THE TIME I HAVE AND FOUND MOST IF NOT ALL OF IT IS BOGUS.” SO WHY SHOULD WE WASTE OUT TIME WITH YOU………….?
TO ALL OPEN MINDED PEOPLE WHETHER MUSLIMS OR NON-MUSLIMS ESPECIALLY FOR INNOCENT AHMADIS TRAPPED IN THE CULT. LISTEN AHMADIYYAT IS A FRAUD AND A FAMILY RUN BUSINESS OF MIRZA CLAN. BASICALLY YOU ARE GIVING THEM MONEY TO FOOL YOU AND KEEP YOU BOUND UNDER THEIR RULES. THIS IS NOT ISLAM. DO YOUR OWN STUDY AND BEWARE OF THE AHMADIYYA/QADIYANI FRAUD.
HERE IS THE FINAL NAIL IN THE COFFIN:
THE DEATH OF A LIAR (I KNOW IN RESPONSE YOU WILL CUT AND PASTE MORE B.S. FROM YOUR AHMADIYYA MOLVIES, WHO CARES YOU DO WHAT YOU WANT WE KNOW WHAT IS TRUE AND FALSE)
@muslim
……….continued from above
Read and be concerned about your hereafter. You are people who exceed limits:
————————————————
Mir Nasir Nawab, father-in-law of MGAQ wrote in his biography, Hayat-e-Nasir:
“The night his holiness fell ill, I was sleeping in my room. When his illness grew severe, they woke me up. I went over to his holiness and found him in great pain. He addressed me saying: ‘I have been stricken with cholera.’ After this, he did not utter a single intelligible and coherent word till he died on Monday, after ten O’clock in the morning.”
(Hayat-i-Nasir, P. 14)
————————————————
Bashir Ahmad, the son of Mirza Ghulam, wrote in his biography:
“My mother informed me that ‘the first attack of looseness of bowels upon the Promised Messiah occurred when he was at his dining room table. Later, I started pressing his legs and he lay in comfort and slept and soon I too slept. After a short while, he again felt the call of nature and he used the bathroom a couple of times without awakening me, After this he felt very weak; he shook me up and laid down on my bed. I recommenced pressing. In a few minutes he told me to go to bed but I refused and continued to press. Once again he had an urge and, being too weak to go to the lavatory, I made arrangement for him close to the bed. He sat down and relieved himself. Next, he laid himself back on my bed and I started pressing again. His weakness grew intense; he had another motion, accompanied this time by vomiting. This paralyzed him so much that when trying to lay back on the bed, he fell on his back and hit his head on the bed post. His condition alarmed me…’.”
(Roohany Khazaen, Vol. 1, P. 11-12; Sirat-ul-Mehdi, P.109)
————————————————
A “Sahabi” of MGAQ reports
“Huzoor (Mirza Ghulam) could not talk two hours before death. Dr. Mirza Yaqoob Baig and Dr. Syed Mohammad Hussein Shah were the attending physicians. Huzoor asked for paper and wrote on it: ‘I have too much dryness. I can’t talk.’ and some other words which could not be read.”
(Al-Fazl, Vol. 25, No. 274, November 24, 1937)
Attn: “a”, “Muslim”
Please note that Allah SWT actually killed Mirza by the feces of another sufferer of Cholera, carried BY THE LEGS OF A TINY FLY! SubhanAllah. This is sufficient for people with conscience to stimulate insight and mend their ways.
A distinctive characteristic of the Qadiani “Murabbis” is their art of twisting facts, putting spin and creating a favourable impression. This is best seen in the following discussion of MGA’s cause of death in Urdu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJUGSEj96BE) by a group of Qadianees.
Watch how Mujeeb Rashed, seemingly a respectable Qadiani in this video pulls wool over eyes of the viewer. 1) He explains that MGA died because of “Ishaal” from stress caused by writing a book. People hardly know that “Ishaal” means diarrhea. 2) When Lahore Rlwy Stn Master refused MGA’s body to be transported by train to Qadian for sanitary reasons b/c MGA was reported to have died of Cholera, his companions obtained a certificate to the contrary from a British Civil Surgeon. Mujeeb Rashed holds this certificate as proof that MGA did not die of Cholera.
Doesn’t Mujeeb Rashed know that in India obtaining such a certificate is not difficult, especially when MGA had schmoozed the British. Mujeeb Rashed cleverly ignored mentioning that Mirza had himself admitted the night before his death to his father-in-law, Mir Nasir Nawab, who mentioned in his biography, Hayat-e-Nasir page 14 (in Urdu), “When I reached Hazrat Saheb and saw his condition, then he addressed me and said: ‘MIR SAHEB. I HAVE DEVELOPED EPIDEMIC CHOLERA’. I think, after that He (MGA) did not say anything coherent till he died next day at 10 am.”
Is direct admission from a horse’s mouth more authoritative or a certificate from a British Raj Civil Surgeon, who did not see MGA? If Mujeeb Rashed had little bit of honesty, he would have atleast mentioned the existence of MGA’s father-in-law’s document. If he wanted, he could have denied its authenticity or the integrity of Mir Nasir Nawab. My source, among others:– (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Y059fqb5vs).
Addendum to my posting of Feb 1, 7.06 am
Dying of Cholera or any other disease is not offensive at all. However, Mirza is accursed because he brought it on himself by his numerous shenanigans that he threw at his fierce opponent, Maulvi Sana Ullah Amritsari, specifically in his last letter to the Maulvi sahib dated April 15, 1907.
This last letter can be seen on Ahmadiyyah website in Mirza authored Collection of Advertisements, compiled in a book titled, Majmooa-Ishteharaat, vol.3 p.578-579. Those who cannot read Urdu should have an independent person read and translate.
In this more than 2-page-letter Mirza proclaimed to Maulvi Sana Ullah, “Thus, that punishment which is not by human hands, but only at the hands of God, such as fatal diseases like Plague and Cholera etc. if are not afflicted upon you in my life time, then I AM NOT FROM GOD.”
In this letter Mirza very earnestly supplicated to Allah SWT to afflict the liar of the two with Cholera or Plague. In the end, he said, “Ameen, Ya Rabbal A’alameen.” At the end of the letter, Mirza gave Maulvi sahib permission to publish it in his own newspaper, which he did. Mirza was afflicted with Cholera on May 26, 1908 (13 months after).
The question of Maulvi Sana Ullah not accepting the challenge does not arise. Mirza did not place a condition for Maulvi sahib to accept his challenge. You only have to read the letter carefully.
by Shaykh Omar Subedar
Towards the end of time many major events are to occur as the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم has foretold. Conditions will become extremely intense and humanity will gradually degenerate. Minor signs of the Final Hour will initially appear followed by a sequence of major signs. The Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم stated, “The signs [of the final hour] are [like] beads put together with a string. When the string will break the beads will [fall] one after the other.” [Häkim: 8639]
Among the many signs of doomsday which the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has informed us of is the advent of the Mahdi (the Guided One) and the return of Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام. The Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم said, “There will certainly be the Mahdi in my nation who will emerge…” [Tirmidhë: 2232]
In another narration he declared, “I swear by He in whose hands my soul is, Ibn Maryam عليه السلام shall descend among you with justice and honesty.” [Tirmidhë: 2232]
While Muslims continue to await the emergence of these two great figures, a certain faction of the community has laid claim that this prophecy has already been fulfilled over 100 years ago and that today we are living in a post Mahdi and Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام era. This segment of society is known today as the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community which was founded in 1889 by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, a person who claimed to be the awaited Mahdi and the promised Messiah himself. The foundations of this group were laid on March 23 1889 when forty people had pledged their allegiance to him and has since spread to various areas of the world.
Mirza’s claims were never received well by the general Muslims and have been a cause of great contention throughout the past, particularly in the Indian sub-continent. Today in Canada the group has become quite established in the community and has begun a series of outreach programs to Muslims and non Muslims alike. Because the masses are unaware of the details the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has provided pertaining to the advent of the Mahdi and the second coming of Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام they become somewhat confused or even influenced by a member of the Ahmadiyya community when being confronted by them and having certain questions and assertions thrown at them. Hence it is our duty to educate ourselves regarding our creed and beliefs in order to distinguish between truth and falsehood. Thus we would like to take this opportunity to explore the claims of Mirza from his own writings and see how consistent they are with the prophecies of our beloved Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم so that we may be able to determine whether he spoke the truth or not.
The Claims of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad
It was after 1891 that Mirza began a series of claims that raised eyebrows throughout the Muslim world. The first of them being that he was told through divine revelation that he was the awaited Mahdi and the promised Messiah. He writes in ‘The Narrative of the Two Martyrdoms’ (Tazkirat-ush-Shahadatain):
“It was disclosed to me through Divine revelation a few years later that the Messiah that had been promised from the earliest time to this nation and that the last Mahdi who was destined to appear after the deterioration of Islam and who was to be granted direct guidance from God and who was to provide once again the spiritual nourishment, as had been preordained and about whom glad tidings had also been given by the Holy Prophet, may peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, himself 1300 years ago, is none other than me. Divine revelations, in this regard, came to me so clearly and persistently that no room for even the least doubt was left in this matter.”
He then shares the revelation he allegedly received, which is considerably lengthy. In it ‘God’ revealed to him:
· Praise is due to Allah Who has made thee “Jesus son of Mary” and taught thee things which thou did not know before. People say, “Whence and how did you acquire this position?” Tell them: Very Unique is my God and no one can hinder His grace. He cannot be questioned for what He does, but people shall be required to answer for their deeds.
· God is He Who has sent His Messenger (i.e. this humble person) with guidance and the religion that is true so that He may cause it to succeed and prevail over all other religions.
· Address no plea to Me concerning the wrong-doers for they are surely going to be drowned and they will make a plan and Allah will also plan, and Allah is the best of planners.
· And build thou the ark under Our Eyes with the help of Our revelation.
When Mirza realized that his claim of being Jesus son of Mary was at odds with the notions held by the general Muslim and Christians alike, he modified his assertion and wrote in the ‘Elucidation of Objectives’ (Taudih-e-Maram),
“Muslims and Christians both believe, albeit with some difference, that the Messiah son of Mary was physically raised to the heavens and that he will descend from the skies at some later time. I have already disproved this notion in the first part of this book. I have also pointed out that the ‘Descent’ or the ‘Coming’ does not mean the coming of the Messiah son of Mary; that actually it is a figure of speech signifying the coming of someone resembling the son of Mary; and that, in accordance with Divine intimation and revelation, it is the present writer—my own humble self—to whom it applies.”
He further claimed in his book ‘Jesus in India’ that Jesus survived the crucifixion and later migrated to Kashmir, India in order to preach to the ‘Lost Children of Israel’. He later passed away there due to old age and is currently buried in a shrine called Roza Bal, located in the Khanyar district of Srinagar, Kashmir.
In conclusion, according to these excerpts, Mirza has declared:
a) He is the Awaited Mahdi
b) He is the replica of Jesus son of Mary
c) He is Allah’s Messenger
d) He has been ordered to construct an ark
e) A flood will come that will drown all the wrong doers.
In order to verify these claims it is imperative that we analyze the Prophet’s صلى الله عليه وسلم traditions regarding these matters before reaching any type of conclusion.
The Mahdi
There are several traditions in which Allah’s Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم has described the Mahdi (the Guided One). In these traditions the Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم has said;
· If there was only a day left of this world, Allah would extend it until He would send a man who is from me; or from my family. His name will be the same as my name and his father’s name will be the same as my father’s name (i.e. Muhammad ibn Abdullah). He will fill the world with fairness and justice just as it will be filled with tyranny and injustice. [Sunan Abu Däwōd: 4282]
· This world will not end until the Arabs are ruled by a man from my family. His name will be the same as my name. [Sunan Abu Däwōd: 4282]
· The Mahdi is from my progeny; from the descendents of Fätima. [Sunan Abu Däwōd: 4284]
· The Mahdi is from me. He will have a high forehead and a curved nose. He will fill the world with fairness and justice just as it will be filled with tyranny and injustice and he will rule for seven years. [Sunan Abu Däwōd: 4285]
In one narration the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has provided details on the Mahdi’s advent. He explained, “There will be a dispute following the death of a ruler (khalifa). A man from the residents of Madina will emerge and run to Makka. [Once in Makka] some Makkans will approach him and bring him out against his will. They will then pledge their allegiance to him between the [Black Stone] corner and the Maqäm [of Ibrähëm عليه السلام].
An army will be sent against him from Shäm (a region that comprised of Lebanon, Israel, Jordan, the Palestinian territories and Syria in those days), which will be swallowed up [by the earth] in Al Baidä, [a place] between Makka and Madina. When people will witness this [sign] the saints of Shäm and the best people of Iraq will come to him and pledge their allegiance to him.
Thereafter a man from the Quraish will arise, whose maternal uncles will be from [the tribe of] Kalb. He will send an army against them (i.e. the Mahdi and those who have pledged their allegiance to him) [to destroy them] however [the Mahdi and his followers] will prevail against them. That [defeated army] will be the forces of Kalb. The true loss will be for he who will fail to witness the spoils of Kalb. The Mahdi will distribute the wealth [acquired from the battle] and will govern the people in accordance to the practice (Sunna) of their Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم.
Islam will become established on the earth and the Mahdi will remain for seven years. He will then die and the Muslims will offer his funeral prayer. [Sunan Abu Däwōd: 4286]
Upon analysing these narrations it becomes extremely difficult to believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was the promised Mahdi for a number of reasons;
1. Contrary to the Prophet’s صلى الله عليه وسلم words: His name will be the same as my name and his father’s name will be the same as my father’s name (i.e. Muhammad ibn Abdullah), Mirza’s full name was Mirza Ghulam Ahmad son of Mirza Ghulam Murtaza.
2. He was neither from the descendants of Fatima رضى الله عنها nor among the progeny of Allah’s Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم, rather he was of Iranian descent, whose forefathers were from the tribe of Barlas; a tribe that lived and ruled in Kish, Sogdiana for 200 years.
3. He did not bear the physical features that were described by the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم, such as having a curved nose etc. nor did he have any authority over the Arabs at any stage of his life. Instead shortly after his claim 34 scholars from Makka and Madina unanimously labelled him an apostate upon being informed by Shaykh Ahmad Rizha Khan about his assertions.
4. He was never a resident of Madina nor did he ever run off to Makka. In fact he never even travelled to the holy cities in his life. Hence there was no pledge of allegiance that was given to him between the [Black Stone] corner and the Maqäm [of Ibrähëm عليه السلام] nor was there any army that was sent up against him from Shäm, which was swallowed up by the earth at Al Baidä.
5. According to the narration above the Mahdi will be forced against his will to take the pledge of allegiance from people, particularly the Makkans. Mirza on the other hand was never compelled in anyway by anyone to take the oath of allegiance from any community, rather he first published an announcement on December 1, 1888 that God revealed to him that whomsoever seeks true faith and piety, should pledge their allegiance to Mirza so that God may shower His mercy and beneficence on them.
Later, on January 12th, 1889 he published another pamphlet in which he laid down ten conditions of the pledge, which were;
I. Till the last day of the devotee’s life, the devotee shall abstain from associating any partners with Allah.
II. He shall keep away from falsehood, cruelty, adultery, dishonesty, disorder, rebellion and every kind of evil.
III. He shall offer prayers (Saläh) five times daily.
IV. He shall not inflict injury on any of Allah’s creatures.
V. He shall bear every hardship for the sake of Allah.
VI. He shall not follow vulgar customs and shall guard himself against evil inclinations.
VII. He shall discard pride and haughtiness and shall live in humility & meekness
VIII. He shall deem his faith, dignity, and the welfare of Islam to be dearer to him than his own life, wealth and children.
IX. He shall have sympathy for all of God’s creatures, and devote his talents to their welfare.
X. He shall establish brotherhood with Mirza, obey him in all good things, and firmly adhere to these rules until the last breath of his life.
On March 23, 1889 he began taking the oath of allegiance at the house of Sufi Ahmad Jan, in the city of Ludhiana. There he laid the foundation of the Ahmadiyya Movement. On the first day forty people pledged the oath of allegiance to him. Among them were:
Maulvi Abdullah Sanori
Chaudhry Rustam Ali
Munshi Zafar Ahmad
Munshi Aroray Khan
Munshi Habib ar-Rahman
Qazi Zia al-din
Mir Inayat Ali
Not a single one of these people were from Makka or of Arabian descent.
6. Contrary to the narrations, Mirza did not pass away 7 years after taking the initial pledge. He rather lived on for another 19 years and passed away in Lahore on May 26, 1908.
In light of all these contradictions, among many more which we have not bothered discussing, one can safely conclude that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was NOT the Mahdi the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم had foretold us about.
The Messiah, Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام
In respect to what really happened to Ësä عليه السلام Allah explains in the Qur’än, “And [We cursed the People of the Scriptures for] their saying, “Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah.” And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain. Rather, Allah raised him to Himself. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise.” [4:157-158]
‘Abdullah ibn ‘Abbäs رضى الله عنهما elaborated on the ascension incident by relating, “When Allah intended to uplift Ësä عليه السلام to the sky, Ësä عليه السلام came out to his companions and [at that time] there were 12 companions that were present in the house; He came out to them, not exiting the house while his head was dripping of water and said, “Among you there is a person who will disbelieve in me 12 times before he places his faith in me.”
He then proposed, “Which one of you is prepared to bear my [physical] resemblance, be killed in my place and [end up] with me in my rank [in Paradise]?”
continued from part 1
A young man, who was the youngest among them stood [and offered himself] however Ësä عليه السلام ordered him, “Be seated,” and repeated the proposal [to his companions]. [Again] the young man stood up but Ësä عليه السلام instructed him to sit down and then once again repeated his offer. The young man stood up once more and said, “I [am ready].”
Ësä عليه السلام then said, “[In that case] you have been selected.”
The young man was then given the [physical] resemblance of Ësä عليه السلام [by Allah] while Ësä عليه السلام ascended from the window of the house to the sky. Later the Jewish pursuers came and seized the [young man] who looked like Ësä عليه السلام and killed him.” [Al Durr al Manthur]
Mirza’s claim of Ësä عليه السلام escaping the crucifixion and migrating to Kashmir, where he later passed away is absolutely inconsistent with the aforementioned texts and hence clearly inaccurate and false.
Regarding the return of Ësä عليه السلام, the Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم once explained to his companions while describing Dajjäl (the Anti- Christ), “The Dajjäl is a young man with curly hair. [One] eye of his is blind. I can liken him to ‘Abdul ‘Uzza ibn Qatän. Whoever comes across him from amongst you, he should recite the opening verses of Sura al Kahf upon him. He will emerge from a place between Shäm and Iraq and will spread mischief right and left. O Slaves of Allah! Remain firm [against him].”
The companions inquired, “O Allah’s Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم, How long will he stay on earth?”
The Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم replied, “40 days; a day like a year, a day like a month, a day like a week and the remaining days will be like your [normal] days.”
The companions asked, “O Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم, [on] that day that will be like a year; will the prayers of one day be sufficient for us?”
He answered, “No, [rather] at that time make calculations [for the timings of the prayers]”
The companions then asked, “How quick will be his pace on earth?”
He replied, “Like rain that is driven by wind. He will approach a community and invite them [to accept his divinity] and they will believe in him and respond to his call. He will then order the sky [to rain] and consequently it will rain. He will give an order to the earth and subsequently it will bring forth produce. Their herds will return to them in the evening with their humps as high as ever, their udders full and their flanks stretched.
He will then go to [another] community and invite them however they will reject his claim [to divinity]. He will then leave them and they will [end up] being afflicted with drought. All of their wealth will be gone from their hands.
He will pass by a [land in] ruins and say to it, “Bring forth your treasures.” As a result its treasures will [come out and] follow him like a swarm of bees. Then he will call a man brimming with youth and strike him with a sword. He will cut him in two pieces and place [each piece] as far [from each other] as a target from an archer. He will then summon him and he will come forth with his face gleaming and laughing.
While he will be engaged in all of this, Allah will send the Messiah, the son of Mary عليه السلام. He will descend by the white minaret in the east side of Damascus, wearing two garments dyed in saffron placing his hands on the wings of two angels. When he will lower his head [water] will drip [from it] and when he will raise it, drops like pearls will scatter from it. Every disbeliever who will come in contact with his breath will die and his breath will reach as far as he can see.
He will then pursue the Dajjäl until he catches him at the gate of Lod [a city located on the Sharon Plain 15kilometers southeast of Tel Aviv in the Center District of Israel] and will then kill him. Thereafter some people, whom Allah had protected from the Dajjäl, will come to Ësä ibn Maryam. He will wipe their faces and inform them of their ranks in Paradise. While he will be busy doing this Allah will suddenly reveal to him, “I have released some slaves of mine, whom no one has the power to fight with. Quickly take my slaves to At-Tur [an Arab neighborhood on the Mount of Olives approximately 1 km east of the Old City of Jerusalem].”
Allah will then send [the two communities of] Ya’juj and Ma’juj (i.e. Gog and Magog) who will descend from every slope. The first of them will pass by the Sea of Tiberias [located in the Jordan Great Rift Valley] and drink all its water. [When] the last of them will pass [by it] they will say, “There was once water here.”
Allah’s Prophet, Ësä عليه السلام and his companions will be put under siege to the extent that a bull’s head to one of them will be better than one hundred dinärs to you today. Allah’s Prophet, Ësä عليه السلام and his companions will then beseech Allah. Consequently Allah will send worms in the necks [of Ya’juj and Ma’juj] and as a result they will be killed all at the same time. The Prophet of Allah, Ësä عليه السلام and his companions will then descend to the ground and will not find even the space of a hand span that will not be filled with their decayed [bodies] and stench. Allah’s Prophet, Ësä عليه السلام and his companions will then beseech Allah and Allah will send birds that will resemble the necks of Bactrian Camels. The birds will carry [their bodies] away and throw them wherever Allah wills. Thereafter Allah will send such rain that no mud house or hut will be sheltered from it. It will cleanse the earth until it leaves it like a mirror. The earth will then be told, “Bring forth your fruits and restore your blessings.”
On that day a group of people will eat a portion of a pomegranate and [then] sit in its skins shadow. Milk will be blessed to the extent that [the milk of a] milch camel will suffice a [large] crowd of people, [the milk of a] milch cow will suffice a tribe of people, [the milk of a] milch sheep will suffice a family of people. [Muslim: 7373]
In another narration the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم said, “Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام will surely descend as a just judge and a fair leader. He will travel through the mountain passes [of Arabia] as a pilgrim for hajj or `umra and will definitely come to my grave and greet me [with saläm] and I shall respond to him.” [Häkim: 4162]
Ibn Al Jawzë has written in his book Al Wafä: ‘Abdullah ibn ‘Amr reported, “Allah’s Messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم mentioned, “Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام will descend to the earth. He will get married and have children. He will remain in the world for 45 years. Thereafter he will pass away and will be buried with me in my grave.”
Upon studying all these narrations and comparing them to the life of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad it once again becomes extremely difficult to acknowledge his assertions for the following reasons:
1. In all of these narrations there is absolutely no indication whatsoever that a replica of Ësä عليه السلام will appear. Rather the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has reiterated the name of Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام several times in the narrations making it very clear that Ësä عليه السلام will be returning in person, not someone like him.
2. The Dajjäl which the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم described in the aforementioned narration never emerged during Mirza’s life. Therefore Mirza never had the opportunity to kill him thus fulfilling one of the prime objectives of Ësä’s عليه السلام return. Likewise the two communities of Ya’juj and Ma’juj never appeared and drank the entire Sea of Tiberias rather the sea is still in existence and intact till today.
3. Mirza did not descend from the sky with the aid of two angels by the white minaret in the east side of Damascus, as highlighted in the aforementioned narration. Although he did attempt to provide an explanation for some of the points discussed in this narration in his book; Removal of Suspicions (Izala i Awham) he unfortunately failed to address many key issues found within the ĥadëth. For example he wrote regarding Damascus;
· Damascus has been used merely in a metaphorical way.
· Then He (God) told me that these people were of Yazid’s nature and this town (Qadian) is similar to Damascus. So the Exalted Allah sent this humble one down to this Damascus for a big purpose.
In respect to the two garments dyed in saffron which Ësä’s عليه السلام will wear during his return Mirza writes, “I am a permanently sick man and the two yellow sheets which have been mentioned in the traditions as those to be worn by Messiah when he would come down, these two sheets are with me. These according to the science of interpretation of dreams are two ailments. Hence one of these sheets is on my upper part so that headache, giddiness, insomnia and palpitation of the heart come to me in the shape of fits. The other sheet which is the lower part of my body is diabetes which has afflicted me for a long time, so that often I have a hundred urinations during the night and day and due to this frequency of urination I am afflicted with all those ailments of debility caused by such a disease.”
Apart from these whimsical interpretations, Mirza never made any mention of;
· The Gate of Lod.
· The death of the disbelievers upon coming in contact with Ësä’s عليه السلام breath.
· The siege Ësä عليه السلام and his companions will be put under at At-Tur.
· The infestation of Ya’juj and Ma’juj’s bodies in the land following their death and the cleansing process that will take place thereafter.
· The immense blessings of the earth that the people will experience after all this drama.
Mirza did nonetheless decide to build a white minaret in his home town of Qadian and even laid it’s foundation on March 13, 1903 however due to a lack of funds its construction was halted. The minaret was continued by Mirza Basheer-ud-Din Mahmood Ahmad on November 27, 1914 and was completed in 1916, eight years after Mirza’s demise. Hence even this action of his was inconsistent with the Prophet’s صلى الله عليه وسلم words, as the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم informed us that Ësä عليه السلام would descend by the white minaret in the east side of Damascus, not have it constructed.
4. Mirza did not live for 45 years after proclaiming to be the replica of Ësä عليه السلام in 1891, rather he only lived for 17 years.
5. As mentioned before Mirza never visited the holy lands of Makka and Madina and hence never performed a hajj or an ‘umra in his life nor did he ever have the opportunity to visit the grave of the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم and greet him by his graveside in person.
6. Mirza did not end up getting buried in the same grave as our beloved Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم but rather in his home town of Qadian.
In conclusion, upon witnessing the tremendous amount of contradictions between Mirza’s life and the Prophets صلى الله عليه وسلم words, one can safely conclude that Mirza’s claim of being the replica of Ësä ibn Maryam عليه السلام is spurious in every shape and form.
The Messenger of Allah
Of all the claims Mirza made during his life, the claim to prophet hood was undoubtedly the most shocking to the Muslim community. He wrote in The Reality of Revelation (Haqëqatul Wahë), “So of all the people of this nation (ummah), I am the only one who has received this big portion of divine revelation and knowledge about the unseen. All the saints of this nation (ummah) who have preceded me, they were not given such a big share of this bounty. For this reason I alone was chosen to be designated a prophet and none else deserved this title.”
This claim particularly stunned the Muslim community because it is in absolute contrast with the verse; Muhammad is not the father of [any] one of your men, but [he is] the Messenger of Allah and the seal of the prophets. (33:40). This verse makes it crystal clear that no prophet is to come after our beloved Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم however the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community of today claims that the implication of the ‘seal of prophets’ in aforementioned verse is; Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم brought prophet hood to perfection and was the last law-bearing prophet and the apex of man’s spiritual evolution. New prophets can come but they must be subordinate to Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم and cannot exceed him in excellence nor alter his teaching or bring any new law or religion.
For the general Muslims this interpretation becomes quite difficult to digest, especially when the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم has thoroughly explained the meaning of the ‘seal of the prophets’ in the following traditions:
· My example and the example of the Prophets before me are like the example of a man who built a house and made it nice and beautiful except for the place of one brick in a corner. People begin to go around it, marvel it and say, “Why has this brick not been put in its place?” I am that brick and I am the seal / last of the prophets. (Bukhari:3535)
· …and they say, “Will you not put a brick here due to which your structure will be completed?” Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم said, “ I am the brick” (Muslim:5960)
· …I have come and finished the (chain of) Prophets (Muslim:5963)
· Indeed the message and prophet hood has come to an end; hence there will be no messenger or prophet after me. (Tirmidhi:2272)
The Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم did further clarify on one occasion, “Had there been a prophet after me it would have been Umar ibn al Khattab.” (Tirmidhë: 3686). Every Muslim acknowledges that Umar ibn al Khattab was never a prophet hence it becomes quite evident that prophet hood has now come to a complete halt. Thus the claim made by the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community of today that new prophets can come but they must be subordinate to Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم is merely a fabricated notion and absolutely contradictive to the authentic teachings of Islam.
The Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم however did warn us:
· In my nation there will be 27 liars and impostors (Dajjäls). Among them will be 4 women. I am definitely the last of the prophets. There will be no prophet after me. (Musnad Ahmad: 23251)
· The [final] hour will not be established until approximately 30 liars and imposters (Dajjäls) will be sent. Each one of them will claim to be the Messenger of Allah. (Bukhäri: 7121)
Consequently it wouldn’t be farfetched to believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmed was definitely one of those 27.
The Ark and the Flood
There is a striking resemblance between the ‘revelation’ Mirza received i.e.
· Address no plea to Me concerning the wrong-doers for they are surely going to be drowned and they will make a plan and Allah will also plan, and Allah is the best of planners.
· And build thou the ark under Our Eyes with the help of Our revelation.
And the following verses of the Qur’an:
· And it was revealed to Noah that, “No one will believe from your people except those who have already believed, so do not be distressed by what they have been doing.
· And construct the ship under Our observation and Our inspiration and do not address Me concerning those who have wronged; indeed, they are [to be] drowned.”[11:36-37]
Nōĥ عليه السلام constructed the ark as instructed and upon the appointed time Allah drowned all the wrongdoers, who were none other than the disbelievers. According to the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community all non Ahmadees are also disbelievers. Mirza Basheer-ud-Din Mahmood Ahmad, the second caliph of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community and the eldest son of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad from his second wife declared in his book ‘The Truth about the Split’, “…the belief that all those so-called Muslims who have not entered into his [i.e. Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s] bai’at formally, wherever they may be, are Käfirs and outside the pale of Islam, even though they may not have heard the name of the Promised Messiah. That these beliefs have my full concurrence, I readily admit.”
Hence this implies that every Muslim who did not pledge their allegiance to Mirza was a wrongdoer and thus up for Allah’s punishment of being drowned. Ironically there are absolutely no records of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad even attempting to execute this ‘divine’ directive and 100 years after his demise we the ‘wrongdoers’ are still waiting to be drowned.
In conclusion the claims of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad have no connection with the truth whatsoever and it is our duty that we warn our community about his deviant teachings in order to safeguard them from being mislead and falling astray.
May Allah protect us all. Ameen
Mashallah a brilliant copy and paste job indeed which exposes the lies of this cults leader
What ahmadis do not realize is there was a reason and hikmah behind all of the details given by our prophet (saw) and that was to distinguish the true mahdi and ISA (as) from the dajjals who will claim to be them…look at what length MGA had to go and twist the hadiths and call them metaphors in order to give his own own spin so they don’t expose him and give him some validity …he only managed to twist a few and had no excuses for the rest ..if i am not wrong did he not prophesise he would either die in MAKKAH or MEDINA? but then twisted that by saying qadian was also called MAKKAH & MEDINA as he knew he would never be able to go there after being branded kafir ?..but evan then ended up dying in LAHORE and not Qadian..is not that a failed prophesy?
our Prophet gave us 1000’s of details of many things..why did he not ever mention a baroozi/zilli/meaphorical/reincarnated second coming of himself/ISA/mahdi/krishna etc??? yet he said the complete opposite..is that not proof enough MGA was a dajjal?
Ahmadis are HYPOCRITES/MUNAAFIQ they claim to believe in hadiths yet totally disregard Sahih hadiths which burst thier bubble and follow weak/fabricated instead.. following your so called messiah’s sunnat of using those that give him some credibility evan if their fabricated and throwing the rest away like waste paper which are considered SAHIH by the rest of the Muslim ummah for centuries ..you either believe in them or you dont!! you have no right to pick and choose!!
Dont you ahmadis ever think that the person (prophet saw) on whom the Quran was revealed would know its true interpretation rather then a man who comes over 1300 years later?
Don’t you ever think that the prophet (saw) would never utter a word against the Quran so when the prophet (saw) says time and time again ( like in his last sermon ) that there is no prophet after me then he truly knew the meaning of HATAM? why do you not follow his teaching? yet on the other hand you claim to be on the true path of Islam…is this what you call true followers? It is us that are his true followers we interpret the meaning of words were unsure about through his teachings..and who else can be a better teacher then the 1 who has been sent as a mercy to mankind? ..yet you want us to follow some man who has hijacked his identity and twists verses and hadiths to suit his agenda?
This is the reason why ahmadis do not like debating the character of their so called messiah..like how would they justify a man who takes money for 50 volumes and gives them 5 instead and says the difference between 50 and 5 is a zero and zero is nothing so i have fulfilled my obligation..??? seriously??? some ahmadis have tried and using the example of how salaat has been given to us from 50 to 5 …well that was ALLAH’s choice he reduced it from 50 to 5 after the prophets plea’s ..but the example of the payment for books is not the same…money was taken with a promise of giving 50 volumes/books but the writer said 5 is enough …if the people who payed said give us 5 instead of 50 then that would be their choice but to give them 5 and say sod off now iv given you 5 and thats enough then that’s dishonesty in any business transaction and you want us to believe he was chosen by ALLAH to be our Messiah? oh PUHLEASEEE!!!
Yes, very true indeed. The more we read about MGA, more we find out that the emperor has no cloths. The funny thing is the quadianis think we are so foolish that we will believe such stupid claims and arguments blindly. Like in two of the posted videos their leaders are forwarding an argument that according to our prophet’s Hadith a Nabi shall come during the time when traveling through air and car will replace camel ride (???) and since Mirza claimed his prophethood during such time, he is a true Nabi in compliance with the prophecy. Wow, What a grand proof! And they wants everybody to believe it? With such blind followers no wonder Mirza’s family is laughing all the way to the bank!
By the way, if somebody is interested in finding out how much one is expected to contribute to Mirza Bank (remember, this is the minimum and compulsory amount but not the end), you can try it out at the following link.
http://www.khuddam.org.uk/departments/maal/calculator/
May Allah save every Muslim from this cult (Ameen).
@ MUSLIM
Your copy/paste spent all the time beating around bush to show how the following quote is misquoted….I read your whole reply….it neither provided context; nor provided explanation of how the following is mis-quoted….all it does is starts to talk about totally irrelevant stuff.
“It is extremely shameful that the Sermon of the Mount, which forms the core of the New Testament was plagiarised by Jesus from the Jewish book, The Talmud, and then he pretended as if it were his own teachings. But since the time this plagiarism has been discovered, the Christians have been suffering a great shame. Jesus committed this act (of forgery) to perhaps gain influence by presenting some good teachings. (Zamima Anjam-e-Atham, Roohani Khazain vol 11 p.290)
Also, having read your whole reply…yes that’s what we do here….investigate…..(So its a wrong place to copy/paste stupid stuff from your cult run literature) and people on this blog are actually familiar with both the Bible and our Glorious Qur’an very thoroughly. So the lies and tricks do not work here.
You wrote in the response to the above quote (copy/pasted):
“For those of you who may not be familiar with the Bible, according to this text of the Christians Jesus is not only the son of God, but someone who kept a prostitute named Mary Magdelane as one of his closest friends. He also drank wine and there are various accounts of him lying to his own disciples, as well as commiting many other sins. So, whilst maintaining his utmost respect for the real prophet Jesus a.s. who is mentioned in the Holy Quran, Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad would respond to Christian …………… “
NO where in the Bible, Mary Magdelane is a prostitute. When did Jesus lie to his disciples and committed many other sin according to the Bible? Even according to Bible, Jesus was sinless. This plus so many other things you wrote regarding Biblical stories are completely imaginary…..This is what you guys do…..mix truth with falsehood. I want everyone to read this so I will keep it short and leave it here.
Enough with tricks/imaginary stories and weird logic that even child knows is fallacious. IF YOU ARE TRUTHFUL; COME TO DEBATE IF MIRZA WAS A PROPHET OR IMPOSTER.
The Qadiyanis have a few interesting similarities with Christians.
1) Organizational set up : a church with hierarchy — Missionaries/Muballigh
2) Psychology applied in their missionary work.
3) Organized support for converts
4)Selection from own-texts for missionary work, rather than proividing a comprehensive idea of ones own ideologies to others
Unlike the Muslims (all sorts includedSunni, Jamaath, Salafi,etc. etc. and even Shias) the Ahmadis( like Christians) have a well trained body of missionaries. They are taught and they learn methods of proselytism and also knowledge about deenul Islam. This army goes around the gullible Muslims talking about whether Jesus (Eesa alihissalam) is dead or alive; if as if that is the fundamental problem.
The Qadiyanis never bring the full texts of MGAQ when they come to talk with Muslims. Instead they love distribute books written by their khalifas who are well educated (at Oxford and so)
Actually we are toomuch disxiplined to start with the beginning..we take that reason of bifurcation that historically came first that it..no lengthy explanations needed!!
Learn something new today which Ahmadiyyas call “Wasiyat”……
“In laymans terms it is basically pledging 1/10th to 1/3rd of your property, belongings and income for a supposed guaranteed entry in to heaven. So after your death instead of helping your loved ones you may have left behind, your money will go to the Jamaat. This is the basic jist of it, of course you have to be an upright Ahmadi and so on but above all you must keep up with your payments. If not, when you die, you can’t have your ticket to heaven until your payment account is settled. A grave innovation in Islam, only Allah (SWT) can judge who will enter paradise and the only hope we have is the intercession on the Day of Judgment of our master, the Holy Prophet Muhammad (SAW). This is Islam but in Ahmadiyya you can buy your way to heaven or so you are told. This is Wasiyat.
Means that you have to pledge 1/10 to 1/3 of ur Property after ur Death to the Jammat
and that you have to pay higher rates of Chanda (the obligatory charity) to the Jammat during ur life time.
All this to get the grave in that speical grave yard in Qadian India, as Ahmadiyyah belief and Mirza Ghulam claim is that those who get buried in that grave yard goes to Heaven.
So get that u have to pay the money and through ur property to get a grave there.(remember there is no such thing in Islam)”
Another thing about this “wasiyyat” system is that MGA and his family are exempt from all conditions, including payment, that apply to other members of this scheme.
So If you fulfill your Wasiyat, You get buried in a grave yard in Quadian, India and Mirza guarantees you Heaven! Astagfirullah.
My question is what happens to those enrolled in this “guaranteed heaven” program gets buried in Canada or other places? Since this program is open to all, we can only assume that the Mirza’s graveyard in Quadiyan is a traveling graveyard!
May Allah save all Muslims from this cult.
i had a look at the link you provided and entered my annual earnings to calculate what id have to pay which almost came to £1500 now iv not been able to save anything for years with running a house/car and paying bills and everyday expenses..and iv not been able to pay 2.5% Zakat either as iv never managed to save anything..how would someone like me be able to pay £1500 extra a year? id literally be struggling to keep my head above water ..Islam asks us to give from what we can afford this is why Zakat is paid on savings and not income this practice is truly out of the fold of Islam…yes we should give there’s no doubt but only give when your able to give without putting yourself into dept ..the whole point of giving is to help the less fortunate but in ahmadiya it seems it puts many in a position where they have to struggle aswel just so that they can remain in a jamaat!! now i know ahmadis will come out in defence but the truth is many ex ahmadis have come out and told the world how they were kicked out for not paying due to their circumstances and made to feel guilty and pressured to pay up and then kicked out..and kept away from their family and friends ..in the time of the prophet (saw) some Sahaba gave majority if not all their wealth because they themselves wanted to please ALLAH yet not everyone can do such a thing this is why ALLAH mentions in the Quran how the companions are pleased with ALLAH and HE is pleased with them ..you cant expect everyday man to just hand over money like the Sahaba ..if ahmadi leadership truly thinks their following the prophet then they to should pay and live in poverty like the prophet (saw) did.. money was needed but it was the MESSAGE of Islam that won the hearts of millions and has grown over 1.5 billion TODAY if you truly believe your a chosen jamaat stop your begging for cash from today and watch how it crumbles to pieces .. the leadership will never stop demanding and neither did their so called messiah who was rolling in cash ..i remember reading a story about how ahmadis were told to give all they can in the time of their messiah and women from the jamaat seen MGA’s female family members wearing expensive clothes and jewelry so they complained to their husbands not to tell them to give all they can for the jamaat when their messiahs family members are so wealthy living lavish lifestyle once again HYPOCRISY comes to mind
Brother : Please have good will towards the ordinary people in this Qadiyani organization. We have to be patient and loving towards them so that they see the truth which at present is masked from them by their prejudice against Muslims. The best way to deal with them is to go through ALL of the writings of MGAQ with them. In the name of God I request all brothers to be very gentle in the discussion so that ordinary men among who happen to go through these may have an urge to find out the reality behind what MGAQ started
In response to “Muslim’s” posting of Jan 31 at 9:49 am above.
“Muslim” has quoted a hadeeth from Hujjaj al-Kiramah and Kanz al-Ummal, wherein Gibraeel AS tells RasoolAllah SAAWS that “there is no prophet but he lives half as long as the one who preceded him. And he has told me (Rasoolallah SAAWS) that Jesus lived a hundred and twenty years, and I see that I am about to leave this world at sixty’.” Therefore, the assumption is that Jesus (pbuh) lived 120 years and died a natural death.
Kanz al-Ummal is a rearrangement of al-Jâmi`al-Kabîr and its annexes that was originally compiled by Imam al-Sûyûtî. When Imam al-Sûyûtî wrote his book, his intention was to gather together all the hadîth that he knew, whether they were authentic or not. Al-Sûyûtî openly admitted that there were some false hadîth in it.
Now according to this formula, if Jesus lived 120 years and RasoolAllah SAAWS lived 60, then Mirza should have been 30-yr-old when he died and the ages of the preceding Prophets up to Adam AS (124000) would be beyond a calculator’s capacity. Does this make sense?
This hadeeth is narrated by a man called Ibn Laheeya, about whom the Muhadatheen unanimously agree that he is “mardood” (inadmissible, rejected, refused) and unworthy of trust. Therefore, this hadeeth cannot be authentic.
Brother Ihsan’s comment above is well-taken. JazakAllahu Khair.
Brothers in Islam:
Let me share my personal experience with you so that it may come in some sort of help in dealing wih this menace to the Deen. My father was an Ahmadi and through him I got in touch with many of that religion. When they acquaint their religion to the Muslims, they have special books for it. Hardly would they bring an original text of their religion,i.e.,any book of of MGAQ. Nor would they talk of their original doctrines; just like Christian Missionaries. I do really suspect that their Missionaries are specifically been instructed not to divulge the real claims of their founder. Like Christian Missionaries they are trained to retain their cool when confronting criticism. But if the Muslim critic could also maintain his cool and pursue the Ahmadi beyond a level, and begin to analyse the claims of MGAQ, it really shows its effect. I remember my experince with an Ahmadi Missionary who , while we were talking about the wish of MGAQ to marry a certain girl, lost his temper and all on a sudden began a tirade against Maulana Maududi and talked about Maududi wanting to marry respected Maryam Jameela. He very well knew I was not Jamaar-e- Islami and Maududi had nothing to do with the subject being discussed. Maududi Sahib at once understood the political nature of this new threat to Islam and was able to gather the support of all Muslims to find a political solution to it; hence their special detest towards him
Another of my experience is here. One of my friends(Muslim of course) was continuously followed by some Ahmadi Missionaries and having not much Madrasa education found it very hard to find answers to certain questions. He came to me knowing that my father was one and I had good exposure to Qadianism. He told me many of their claims seemed valid arguments. I did not ask him anything about those claims. Instead I told him to be firm on one demand : that he should ask them to bring all the original books of MGAQ with them when they came to meet him next. I proposed he should go through all of them taking the help of an Urdu expert if needed. You know what happened next. The qadianis no longer troubled him.
I know many Ahmadis who are not aware of the personal history of their founder. All that they have is a complacency that what they have got is the truth and a blind conviction that the general Muslims are mislead by what they call Mullas or Moulvis. They are ignorant of free thinking capabilities of many a Muslim. I am sure many ordinary Ahmadis cant think of the real existance of many young Muslims who listen to religious leaders and Ulemas of various groups among Muslims yet have their own opinion and follow the deen to the best of THEIR understanding. Which Ahmadi will put any of the statements of their Khaleefa even to the slightest criical anlysis?
Ihsan you are totally wrong. I am an average Ahmadi and I know that our community asks everybody to read books of Hazrat mirza Ghulam Ahmed all the time. I have myself bought his books and I have read some of them and they are totally amazing and out of the world and they show that he was the one chosen by Allah
Office of Religious Rights & Freedom Launched by Prime Minister Stephen Harper
The Office of Religious Rights & Freedom was Officially Launched by The Prime Minister of Canada – Hon. Stephen Harper on February 19th 2013 at the newly built Aiwan-e-Tahir (Tahir Hall), a Community Centre by the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in Canada.
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpW4LGm_WZE
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmY__kMBxfQ
Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE74x5ohPbI
Part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNhoJN-ONDM
Part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfR1t9KQ8Ws
I would better like to highliht the ‘whys’ and why nots about making the character of mirza saheb the topic in the house first.well we guys seem to mix up the sugar of spirituality sitting on the seat of debate which is emotionalizing the scenario and making it complex.Allah would support your cause when you havea zeal to know..but here all we have is to make people know what you know without thinkingth at what you know is not what nabi kareem saw wanted you to know.our mindset is biased so you are on thespot of a debate and not discussion…so whenyou talk about it be very practical and dont take analysis like they dinttalk on his character so they are wrong andconfused well then youdinttalk on finality of prophethood you are confused there so may not mirza saheb but you awaitsomeone..how does that derivation
goeson you?pinching riht?brother man has his capabalities, abilities and a specialization and most important interest…your topic dddoesnt interests…i mean when people can sitdown to allege maryam and still havestrongfaith in there allegations cant you be victimized by that blasphemy?
Hi there, You’ve done a great job. I’ll certainly digg it and personally suggest to my
friends. I’m sure they will be benefited from this web
site.
Hey I am so glad I found your web site, I really found you by mistake, while I was browsing on Bing for something else, Anyways I am here now and would just
like to say kudos for a incredible post and a all round thrilling
blog (I also love the theme/design), I don’t have time to look over it
all at the momennt but I have bookmarked it
and also added your RSS feeds, so when I have time
I will be back to read much more, Please do keep
up the fantastic work.
I’ve been browsing online greater than 3 hours as of late, but I never found any attention-grabbing
article like yours. It is pretty price sufficient for me.
Personally, if all web owners and bloggers made excellent content material as
you probably did, the net will probably be a lot more useful than ever before.