Abdullah Al Andalusi’s debate with Tommy Robinson (Head of the EDL)
Posted: May 25, 2012 Filed under: articles by Abdullah, Debates 5 Comments »
Muslim-Christian Debate in Abbasid Baghdad
Posted: May 25, 2012 Filed under: articles by Paul Williams, Book review/recommendation, Christianity, Debates, Islam | Tags: Abbasid Baghdad, Abu Uthman al-Jahiz, christianity, islam 1 Comment »
I have just come across a fascinating account of Christians living in the third/ninth century Abbasid Baghdad to be found in the work of Muslim theologian Abu Uthman al-Jahiz (died 255/869) in a letter he wrote to some Muslim friends who had asked for his help against a group of Christians. He outlines for them the way in which Christians treat Muslims in debate:
‘They choose contradictory statements in our Hadiths, our reports that have weak chains of transmitters, and the equivocal verses in our Book, and they take to one side our weak and common people and ask them questions about them. Despite the ideas they have learnt from the heretics and accursed atheists, they often appear innocent before our intellectuals and people of influence. Hence they stir up trouble among the powerful, and cause deception among the weak-minded. And the pity is that each and every Muslim thinks he is an expert in religious matters, and that no one is better at arguing with heretics than anyone else!’
Quotation in Early Muslim Polemic against Christianity Abu ‘Isa al-Warraq’s “Against the Incarnation”, edited and translated by David Thomas, published by University of Cambridge Oriental Publications 59 in 2002.
David Thomas comments,
‘This depicts the Christians as completely unscrupulous in the way they confused ordinary Muslims by presenting spurious or difficult statements from Muslim scriptural sources, and confuted experts with arguments they innocently passed off as not their own. It is undoubtedly exaggerated.’ (page 7)
Exaggerated or not, the description is undoubtedly fitting of some Christians we deal with today as we well know – mentioning no names! How little has changed in over a thousand years…
Quranic Preservation VS Biblical Preservation
Posted: May 18, 2012 Filed under: articles by Sami Zaatari, Christianity, Debates, The Bible, The Qur'an 4 Comments »The topic of Quranic and Biblical preservation is often brought up, so I thought it would be good to highlight some major differences between the two books in terms of preservation, allowing everyone to see who has the better and stronger position.
So let us start with the Quran and give a rundown of the facts:
-The Quran was written and memorized during the lifetime of Muhammad (PBUH).
-The Quran was collected into a complete book during the reign of Abu Bakr, the first caliph of Islam, and the right hand man of Muhammad (PBUH).
-The Quran was collected by the companions of the prophet Muhammad, those who knew, and lived with him during its revelation.
-The Quran was duplicated into official standardized copies for the new Muslim population; this task was ordered by the third caliph of Islam, Uthman, who was also a close companion of the Prophet Muhammad. The very manuscript that Uthman used to copy, was the one which Abu Bakr had collected into an official Quranic book.
So all of the above was how the Quran was preserved, and this is all recorded in the Hadith literature. Now as for the Bible:
-The Gospels were written decades after Jesus.
-The Gospels were written by authors who did not know Jesus.
-The Gospels were written by authors who did not meet Jesus.
-The Gospels were written by anonymous authors, we don’t actually know they are, we are left but to guess.
-The actual Gospel manuscripts we do have are not even the originals, rather they are the copy’s of the copy’s of the copy’s of the books that were written decades after Jesus, by unknown authors, who did not know, or meet Jesus!
-It wasn’t until CENTURIES after Jesus that Christians finally established an orthodox cannon of scripture, yet even after this, there were still disputes, and some books were still rejected and accepted.
-Since there was no official Church orthodox cannon for centuries, you had several different Bible cannons for 400 years, different books claiming to be inspired, each Christian sect having their own Bible which they believed in.
-Up to this day we still see this problem, most notably with the Catholic and Protestant Bible, each having a different cannon. Did the Catholics add too much? Or did the Protestants leave too much out?
And that right there is the story for Bible preservation! And Christians don’t even dispute this! You can readily read upon these facts from Christian scholarly books on the textual history of the Bible. These are all facts, not conspiracy theories.
Recommended watching:
Bassam Zawadi had an excellent debate with Nabeel Qureshi concerning the preservation of the Quran, and suffice to say, it was like teacher (Zawadi) teaching student (Qureshi):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMcxWXrpYxE Part one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMoNBgMsipM&feature=related Part two
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9iDRMXDWNU&feature=related Part three
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gRY1SN_jOM&feature=related Part four
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwJEh8k8GbY&feature=related Q & A
Muhammad and Jesus: Are they Relevant to Society?
Posted: May 7, 2012 Filed under: articles by Sami Zaatari, Christianity, Debates, Islam, MDI, MDI UK, Videos 3 Comments »MDI’s debate with Jay Smith is now available for viewing. The topic of discussion surrounding this debate was the relevance of Muhammad and Jesus within modern day societies, from both a Muslim, and Christian Perspective.
The Niqab Debate: Banning Freedom
Posted: May 4, 2012 Filed under: articles by Dr Tabasum Hussain, Debates, Hadith, Islam, Islamophobia, MDI Canada, Militant Secularism, Women in Islam | Tags: Face Veil, mdi canada, Niqab, Women in Islam 3 Comments »The Niqab Debate: Banning Freedom
Author: Dr Tabasum Hussain, MDI, Canada.
Recently, the Dutch government announced a ban on the face veil to take effect in 2013. In September 2010, the French Senate succeeded in implementing a ban against the niqab and burqa by passing an act “prohibiting concealment of the face in public spaces.” While Belgium and Italy have also imposed similar bans, other countries across the European Union and as far as Australia also seek to follow suit.
The average person may be inclined to believe that those who oppose the ban against the face veil represent an extremist minority of “Islamists” who want to impose an archaic oppressive practice to isolate and subjugate Muslim women. Conversely, the aggressive drive to ban the face veil across the secular world may be interpreted as an act of discrimination and oppression against Muslim women, especially at a time when extreme right wing parties are gaining popularity throughout Europe. Many arguments have been put forward in support of or against the growing push to ban the face veil. The fundamental question is, what is the validity or strength of any of the arguments in justifying a legal ban against an item of religious clothing worn by a minority population in a “free” secular society? Before attempting to address this question, the origins, symbolism, and purpose of the face veil need to be examined to better understand the debate that surrounds it.
Origins, Symbolism, and Purpose of the Face Veil
In today’s context, it is commonly assumed that the face veil is rooted in, and exclusive to Islam. However, the practice of veiling the face can be traced back to pre-Islamic civilisations. The badekin ritual is a Jewish wedding custom apparently rooted in the Old Testament of the Bible (Genesis 29: 19-27), and involves the groom veiling and then unveiling his bride’s face before and after the marriage ceremony respectively. A more idyllic interpretation of the badekin ritual is that it is a gesture to show the groom’s protection over his bride, and it demonstrates his acceptance of her beyond a superficial desire for external beauty. According to the Torah, the masveh (Hebrew term for veil) covered Moses’ face to filter divine glare. Similarly, when the groom lifts the veil from his bride’s face, he is the first to witness the glow of purity that emanates from her face. More profoundly, from a Judaic perspective, the masveh serves to separate man from God for him to better realise the transcendent reality of the unseen God.
There are also other non-Islamic examples of women veiling. Lloyd Llewellyn-Jones, in his book entitled “Aphrodite’s Tortoise: The Veiled Woman of Ancient Greece”, asserts that extant textual and artistic references point to the habitual veiling of women of high status in public in ancient Greece. Also, 15th century Crusaders viewed an Arab woman’s veil as a symbol of feminine purity, and this admiration later translated into the Christian virginal white bridal veil. Dubbed the father of Latin Christianity and known for coining the term “Trinity”, the early Christian apologist Tertullian (Quintus Septimius Florens Tertullianus) clearly described veiled pagan women of a pre-Islamic Arabia. In his book entitled “The Veiling of Virgins” (200 AD), Tertullian wrote that pagan Arab women “not only cover their head, but their whole face, preferring to enjoy half the light with one eye rather than prostituting their whole face.” It is worth mentioning that an unveiled woman in Islam is not described as “prostituting her face”.
What is undoubtedly clear is that the face veil has historically been viewed in a positive light as a respectful symbol of feminine purity and modesty, and not always as a symbol of oppression or subjugation as currently perceived. It has been suggested that such evidences of face veiling in a pre-Islamic context may be ignored in order to dissociate a perceived superiority of these civilisations from the current negative status of the Muslim niqab, the “alien other” that defies the social norms of today’s fashion trends, or what is deemed socially acceptable. During the latter part of the nineteenth century, liberals and reformers began to castigate women’s religious clothing, aligning assimilation of liberal western culture with progress.
An Islamic Practice?
An argument at the forefront of the niqab debate among both Muslims and non-Muslims is that the face veil was a pre-Islamic pagan practice and has no basis in Islam. For those pushing for a ban against the niqab, the claim that the face is not connected to Islam has provided a means to avoid implications of discrimination against a religious minority, especially for politicians. The late Sheikh Tantawi of Al-Azhar Mosque and University is one of the most quoted Islamic scholars to have openly supported a ban against the niqab. Another prominent member of the council of clerics at al-Azhar, Abdel Muti al-Bayyumi, is quoted as saying, “I want to send a message to Muslims in France and Europe. The niqab has no basis in Islam.” He further added, “I personally support the ban and many of my brothers in the Islamic Research Academy support it.”
Above and beyond the reputation of al-Azhar being one of the institutions central to Sunni Islam for learning and scholarship, it would be disingenuous to claim that veiling the face has no representation in Islamic history or Islamic practice. The face veil has been discussed in positive terms in classical Islamic literature and works of legal jurisprudence including: al-Nawawi’s Majmu, Ibn Qudamah’s Mughni, Ibn Abideen’s Radd al-Muhtar, and Ibn Abd al-Barr’s al-Tamhid, to name a few. Essentially, it is agreed upon by mainstream Islamic scholarship that the wives of the Prophet Muhammad observed the practice of veiling their faces to maintain integrity, and as a special safeguard against gossip or slander. Due to the Prophet’s wives being regarded as the best of examples for Muslim women, the face veil became a part of early Muslim tradition and practice. The face veil continues to be practiced by a minority population of Muslim women on the basis of religious belief, and a desire to attain what is perceived as the highest personal level of modesty and spirituality.
As a result of underlying differences in interpretation of the Qur’an and Sunnah concerning modesty and dress code, an internal debate surrounding the face veil has persisted among Muslims throughout Islamic history. Although the majority opinion in Islamic scholarship is that veiling the face is not obligatory, there is still a minority of Muslims supported by scholars who support the view that it is obligatory. However, an outright ban on Muslim women veiling the face has never been at the forefront of debate until Muslim scholarship came under increasing pressure from secular nations in the midst of anti-Muslim sentiment. Consequently, arguments against the niqab have drawn more attention in recent times. It is therefore important and relevant to the debate to shed light on some of these more popular claims within an Islamic context.
Due to the fact that some pagan women were known to veil their faces during the pre-Islamic period, some Muslims assert the view that anything attributable to pre- or even post-Islamic pagan practice should be rejected and deemed un-Islamic. This argument would be illogical considering that other rituals or practices such as fasting, turbans, or beards were also among many pre-Islamic pagan practices that were not rejected. Some Muslims also argue that a woman should not wear the niqab because Islam is a religion that does not impose hardship or place burden on anyone greater than they can bear. However, this argument is purely subjective and depends on how a veiled woman sees fit to define “hardship” or “burden”. A senior lecturer and an Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, Shaykh Ahmad Kutty, has suggested that if a woman was required to veil her face, then it would not make sense that the Qur’anic verse 24:30 should instruct men to lower their gaze. On the basis of such a supposition, a man’s gaze should not need to be restricted if a woman veils, or it should be understood that all men would adhere to the instruction of lowering their gaze, or even that a man’s stare beyond an initial glance would be welcomed by a woman. This interpretation would also assume that a man is not attracted to a woman’s eyes, feet, physique, or even walk. Moreover, Shaykh Kutty would need to explain how his interpretation of the Qur’anic verse 24:30 should have been better understood by the wives of the Prophet Muhammad in context of the following hadith narration, in which the Prophet Muhammad’s much respected wife Aisha is reported to have said:
The riders would pass us while we were with the Messenger of Allah. When they got close to us, we would draw our outer cloak from our heads over our faces. When they passed by, we would uncover our faces
Arguably the most popular claim against the niqab within an inter-Muslim context is that the Prophet Muhammad explicitly prohibited the practice of veiling the face during the pilgrimage to Mecca. However, there is no evidence to support the opinion that women were or should be forced to remove it indefinitely other than during this pilgrimage period. Among other things, men and women are also instructed to cease sexual relations during the pilgrimage period, and so it would be absurd to assume that anything prohibited during the pilgrimage period should be considered a permanent injunction. If it is reasonable to assume that there is no clear instruction from the Prophet Muhammad that all women should wear the face veil, it is also reasonable to assert that the Prophet Muhammad would have provided clear instruction on the matter if prohibition of veiling the face was intended for all times.
Certain marginal liberal secularist Muslim groups currently pushing for a ban against face veiling in Canada insist that the face veil is not part of Islam, stating that “invoking religious freedom to conceal one’s identity and promote a political ideology, is disingenuous.” Inevitably, whether veiling the face should be considered obligatory or optional for Muslim women, it cannot be banned on the premise that it is alien to Islamic practice. To even demand a ban based on the opinion that the face veil has no basis in Islam would be difficult in the Supreme Court of Canada. In the 2004 case of Syndicat Northcrest v Amselem, the court ruled in favour of Orthodox Jews being allowed to build succah huts on the balconies of their high-rise condominiums. Notably, the Supreme Court stated:
In essence, religion is about freely and deeply held personal convictions or beliefs connected to an individual’s spiritual faith and integrally linked to one’s self-definition and spiritual fulfilment, the practices of which allow individuals to foster a connection with the divine or with the subject or object of that spiritual faith.
The court further commented that:
The State is in no position to be, nor should it become, the arbiter of religious dogma… Courts should avoid judicially interpreting and thus determining, either explicitly or implicitly, the content of a subjective understanding of religious requirement…”
Justice Iacobucci stated, “It is not within the expertise and purview of secular courts to adjudicate questions of religious doctrine”.
Dignity and Subjugation of Women
As already discussed, in the absence of evidence that demonstrates whether or not all veiled women were forced to veil, it is reasonable to assume that the veil was not always historically viewed as a symbol of oppression. However, it is also reasonable to assume that the current view of the face veil being a symbol of subjugation that undermines gender equality may have some basis or truth to it. As battles rage across Iraq and Afghanistan to eradicate “Islamist terrorism”, we are occasionally reminded that the invading armies also serve to liberate the people of these war-torn nations. This idea or need for liberation is often reinforced by images of burqa-clad women seeking freedom from a constrictive dress code imposed by an oppressive “Islamist” Taliban regime. However, the noble claim of liberation is undeniably questionable in view of the fact that the burqa was of very little concern when the same Taliban regime was supported in the fight against the Soviet Union. In fact, it is known that the Afghan mujahideen guerrilla movement was unofficially given both financial and military support from countries that included the U.S., Britain, and Israel. While there is mention of liberating the oppressed women of Afghanistan who are forced to veil, the issue at hand is the freedom of Muslim women across secular nations in the West who choose to veil. If it is argued that forcing a woman to veil translates into subjugation of women, then it is fair to say that a woman who is denied her right to choose also falls victim to subjugation and oppression. The head of Sharia Studies at UAE University and Baghdad University said that while waging war against Iraq and killing thousands for the supposed cause of democracy, the West could not tolerate freedom of women to wear the niqab. He said:
Staunch supporters of democracy and liberties in France and the West could not allow freedom of Muslim women to wear the niqab. Muslims who force women to wear the niqab and people in the West who deprive Muslim women from the freedom to wear it are ignorant.
In 2009, French President Nicolas Sarkozy said:
The issue of the burqa is not a religious issue, it is a question of freedom and of women’s dignity…The burqa is not a religious sign; it is a sign of subjugation, of the submission of women…
For the women who have chosen to wear the face veil or burqa it is a “religious sign”, and for these women it means “submission” to God. Hind Ahmas, one of two women fined in May 2011 for defying the ban in France stated that the ban “…simply violates my individual freedom, my freedom of thought, of religious expression, and practice”. By imposing a ban, Sarkozy has effectively succeeded in stripping these women of what they perceive to be a personal elevated sense of spirituality, freedom, and dignity. Muslim women who are denied the freedom to observe their choice of religious dress code have effectively been forced to submit to dignity and freedom as dictated by Sarkozy and other like-minded individuals. If challenged, it is possible that none of Sarkozy’s comments would legally justify a ban against the Muslim woman’s face veil within the framework of either French secular law or the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR).
How is dignity and freedom to be understood when it is applied in a secular context? In France, a woman is not “free” to veil her face because it goes against the dignity of a woman, but a woman is “free” to remove all her clothing to entertain voyeurs as part of a lucrative porn industry. Of course it may not be in the political or financial interest of any government to be concerned, because according to the online business and finance magazine Economy Watch, the porn industry is a major component of the world economy known to generate significant revenue and employment. In fact, in December 2005, BBC News reported that Italian Finance Minister Giulio Tremonti had pushed through Parliament a new 25% tax on all hardcore pornography at a time when Rome was “…desperate to find new revenue because it has to trim its budget deficit to meet EU rules.” The report also stated that this tax was similar to the one imposed in France that would apply to all hardcore pornography, including films, magazines, and merchandise sold in sex shops. Mr. Tremonti commented that “…just like his French colleague”, he was imposing what he called an “ethical” tax.
It is often asserted that women in the porn or sex industry are earning a living from something they choose to do, and that this cannot be equated with or compared to the forceful subjugation of women behind a face veil. According to the 1997 report from the Director General of the United Nations Bureau, research findings reveal that women and girls are often coerced into the sex industry, estimated at 200 million worldwide. Sexual pleasure or financial gain through the abuse or exploitation of women involves abating a woman’s right to dignity and autonomy. In a research study published by Norma Hotaling in 1999, in San Francisco, 88 percent of women in prostitution expressed the desire to leave the profession, 73 percent said they were in need of job training, and 67 percent said they needed drug and alcohol rehabilitation. In 1998, the Feminism & Psychology journal reported that internationally 92 percent of women prostitutes said they wanted to leave prostitution. President Sarkozy stated that the law “is to protect women from being forced to cover their faces.” France’s domestic intelligence agency DCRI (Direction Centrale du Renseignement Intérieur) reported that the majority of women who wear the face veil in France (initially reported as 400, a reassessment was requested) out of an estimated 2000 Muslim women in a total Muslim population of about 5 million in France, choose to do so. These findings reveal an obvious discrepancy between definitions of, and concern for the dignity and submission of women in the sex industry on an international scale, versus concerns for a minority population of veiled Muslim women in secular countries such as France.
Italy’s Equal Opportunities Minister Mara Carfagna, who posed nude for the international men’s magazine, Maxim, has called for the Muslim burqa and niqab to be banned, referring to them as “symbols of the submission of women”. It is worth noting that during the infamous 1968 protest against the Miss America beauty pageant, feminist protesters discarded items such as bras, girdles, high-heeled shoes, and copies of Playboy magazine into a “freedom trash can”, describing these as oppressive. In other words, in absence of any evidence or claim of coercion, defining dignity, subjugation, or oppression of women on the basis of her clothing in any given society is subjective, and therefore not a legally viable argument against the niqab.
Gender Equality
Under the pretext of morals and the fundamental rights and freedom, it is argued that a Muslim woman’s religious clothing undermines gender equality. On announcing implementation of a ban against the niqab and burqa to take effect in the Netherlands in 2013, the Dutch government stated “Having to wear a burqa or niqab in public goes against equality of men and women. With this legislation, the Cabinet is removing a barrier to these women participating in society”. If gender equality is defined on the basis of a woman’s clothing, then a woman’s attire across secular countries can also be scrutinised for undermining gender equality. In a 2006 issue of the Yale Journal of Law and Feminism, Associate Professor of Law, Kathleen Bergin wrote the following:
Sex is not just a commodity for pimps, prostitutes, and pornographers. It is an asset deployed daily, though perhaps less visibly, by women in more “mainstream” professions. Lawyers are no exception. In popular film and television, female attorneys sport short skirts and low-cut blouses, and flirt outrageously with a judge and jury in order to promote a clients interest. For better or worse, hyper-sexualized Hollywood fantasies reflect that reality that sex sells and can be negotiated in the service of female attorneys, whose very presence in the courtroom collides with still-prevailing normative constructs about the proper role of women. The lawyer’s responsibility to “zealously represent” her client creates even more pressure to invoke sexualized stereotypes some feminists consider demeaning to women in order to fulfill professional obligations. If we understand and accept the power of sex appeal to sell cars, cologne, and airline tickets, we can understand why women may use it to sell the theory of a case, the merits of a motion, the innocence of a defendant. In fact, we may question why they would not.
In 2005, in the Psychology of Women Quarterly, issue 29, Professor Peter Glick reported that “‘sexy-attired’ women in high status jobs are perceived as less competent”. Similarly, in a study conducted by Susan Fiske, Professor of Psychology at Princeton University, the brain region that regulates a man’s hostility towards women is deactivated when men are exposed to images of scantily dressed women. People are nowadays often condemned for criticising women’s liberal dress fashions as attracting negative male attention and harassment, yet these studies clearly outline the negative impact that a scantily dressed woman can have on the opposite gender. Despite this, it would be inconceivable that a secular country should call for bans against a woman’s “sexy attire” on the basis of it undermining gender equality and/or women’s safety.
In response to studies quoted so far, some people would argue that gender equality cannot be defined or decided according to a woman’s clothing, but should be based on an appreciation of more intrinsic gender-specific qualities of a woman, as well as her general intellectual attributes and abilities regardless of gender. Arguably, it is not the veil on a woman’s face that is discriminatory, or undermines gender equality, rather it is the people who fail to appreciate or look at a veiled Muslim woman beyond the walls of misconception, misinformation, or prejudice.
Is there a defined standard in secular dress codes that ensures gender equality? If such secular or modernist dress standards were to exist, should Muslims or even members of other religious minorities be forced to conform to such standards? To justify a ban against the face veil on the basis that religious dress code undermines gender equality would be problematic, unless it was inclusive of the practices of other religions that differentiate between men and women. Orthodox Jewish women are, for example, required to cover their hair after marriage because the beauty of their hair should only be shared with their husbands. To achieve this, some ultra-orthodox Jewish women shave their heads and a wear either a tichel (a handkerchief type of cloth) or a wig. Should this be interpreted as undermining gender equality? The Biblical verse Deuteronomy 22:5 states, “A woman must not wear men’s clothing, nor a man wear woman’s clothing for the Lord your God detests this.” In accordance with this Old Testament passage, a Jewish woman is barred from wearing trousers because they are categorised as men’s clothing, and it is considered immodest for a woman to wear trousers. As a general rule of thumb, a man wearing a dress would be going against the “norm”, but it is not interpreted as gender inequality for men. It would be reasonable to assume that dress code that differentiates between male and female serves to enhance or contribute to masculinity or femininity. To assume that gender-specific religious clothing is a symbol of gender inequality or subjugation of women is subjective, and can only be established on a case-by-case basis, and upon consideration of whether the woman has been forced or whether it is perceived as oppressive by the woman concerned. In fact, it would be reasonable to assume that laws already exist to protect women from being forced to do anything, let alone being forced to cover her face. In a “free” society, it would depend on how willing a woman would be to seek help, and whether or not help would even be available; sadly, this is a major global concern for women suffering domestic abuse in many forms. Essentially, gender inequality does not qualify as a valid argument to justify imposing a law on women who may choose to accept a religiously defined dress code as spiritually rewarding, regardless of whether or not it is in agreement with mainstream opinion or norms.
Defining “Freedom”
Chrystelle Khedrouche, a 36-year-old French-born Muslim convert, said, “The French like the idea of everyone being of the same mould and that mould must be ideal. I have made the choice not to be unveiled… so to force me to unveil – that’s not freedom.” The French ban on the niqab was condemned by Amnesty International as a violation of the freedom of expression of the women who choose to wear it willingly. Among several veiled women who protested in Paris against the ban, Kenza Drider, stated that she was “just expressing freedom to be.”
Is religious freedom absolute? Absolutely not. In accordance with articles 4 and 5 of the French 1789 Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen, freedom is defined as:
…The power to do anything that does not injure others… the rights of each man has no limits except those that secure the enjoyment of these same rights to other members of society. The law has only the right to forbid such actions as are injurious to society.
France also ensures equality for all citizens regardless of religion or race under the “1958 Constitution of the Fifth Republic”. Evidently, French legislation avoided any implications of religious discrimination by stipulating that the ban is inclusive of all forms of face concealment such as helmets, balaclavas, masks etc. Despite this, the exceptions to the rule permit helmets or face coverings for their intended purposes of safety, as well as headdresses or masks that cover the face for established carnivals or festivals. Inevitably, the greater impact of the ban is to be felt by a minority of Muslim women who choose to veil their faces for religious reasons.
Under article 18 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR): “Everyone shall have the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion…to manifest his religion or belief in worship, observance, practice and teaching.” The ICCPR further states:
Freedom to manifest one’s religion or beliefs may be subject only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and are necessary to protect public safety, order, health, or morals or the fundamental rights and freedoms of others.
The question remains, does the Muslim face veil have enough of an impact on public safety, order, health, or the fundamental rights and freedoms of others to justify a ban?
Detrimental to Health
According to the French 1789 Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen, “The law has only the right to forbid such actions as are injurious to society”. How is it decided that something is “injurious” enough to society that it should be prohibited by law? Among the criticisms hurled against the burqa is that vision and hearing are impaired. However, a credible survey or medical assessment of women who choose to wear either would be needed to support the validity or credibility of such a claim.
One of the popular claims against the burqa is that it is detrimental to a woman’s health due to lack of exposure to the sun increasing the risk of vitamin D deficiency. It is argued that the burqa is injurious to women in view of the fact that vitamin D deficiency can cause various health complications such as osteoporosis, hypertension, and depression. According to Stefanie Williams, Medical Director of the European Dermatology Clinic in London, UK; “The amount of vitamin D you are able to make depends on many factors, including your skin colour, age, weight, where you are in the world and the season”. On average, 15-20 minutes of daily sun exposure without the aid of sun block creams is recommended by the National Osteoporosis Society in conjunction with the British Association of Dermatologists. Undoubtedly, lack of exposure to the sun can lead to a deficiency in vitamin D, but this deficiency can be remedied or avoided by taking vitamin D supplements, increasing dietary intake of food high in vitamin D, as well as taking advantage of a private garden or outdoor space to sunbathe.
From a legal perspective, the vitamin D deficiency argument fails when attempting to justify a ban against a woman’s choice of clothing. If a woman’s clothing is injurious to her health, then there is no shortage of evidence that points to lack of adequate clothing also being injurious. Overexposure to the sun is the most important risk factor for most types of skin cancer. In the U.S. for example, skin cancer has increased in women under age 40; incidence of basal cell carcinoma has reportedly more than doubled in the last 30 years, and squamous cell carcinoma has increased almost 700 percent. Despite this, to seek a ban against bikinis, or even to seek enforcement of time limits on how long a woman is permitted to expose herself under the sun would not be worthy of serious consideration in a secular society. To even suggest that the law has the right to intervene in any such way on the basis of overexposure to sun being injurious would be met with extreme opposition in a secular society that demands the safeguarding of certain personal rights and freedoms.
Social Cohesion and Integration
One of the main arguments at the forefront of the niqab debate is that it serves to block communication and interaction between people in a society that relies on facial expression and recognition. This in turn is implicated in negatively affecting social cohesion and integration. The French government claimed that the burqa damaged community relations. In 2006, the British Foreign Secretary, Jack Straw, drew much criticism as well as support when he made the following comments in reference to the niqab:
Communities are bound together partly by informal chance relations between strangers — people being able to acknowledge each other in the street or being able pass the time of day…That’s made more difficult if people are wearing a veil.
In December 2011, Canadian Immigration and Multiculturalism Minister, Jason Kenney, announced that Muslim women will be required to remove the face veil during the citizenship swearing-in ceremony. Kenney stated: “It is a cultural tradition which I think reflects a certain view about women that we do not accept in Canada...” Contrary to what Mr. Kenney may think, the Canadian judiciary does not penalise individuals for their religious or cultural beliefs simply because someone does not accept “a certain view”. The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (CCRF) states that everyone has “(a) freedom of conscience and religion; (b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression…” (as determined using the two steps outlined in the Oakes test). Mr. Kenney would need to elaborate on why he thinks the face veil should not be accepted in the citizenship ceremony, and why the right to wear the veil during this ceremony would not be covered under the Charter. He stated that citizenship “…defines who we are as Canadians including our … values that are rooted in our history.” It has become a common claim across secular nations that rejection of the face veil serves to protect or reserve “values that are rooted in our history.” Yet, there is a failure to provide any clear definition or explanation of what exactly these “values” are, or what aspect of “history” or “heritage” such comments pertain to. Perhaps any such attempt to clarify would undermine the very secular values politicians claim to champion. The 1998 Canadian Federal Government Statement of Reconciliation that addresses the indigenous people of the First Nations of Canada states the following:
Sadly, our history with respect to the treatment of Aboriginal people is not something in which we can take pride… As a country, we are burdened by past actions that resulted in weakening the identity of Aboriginal peoples, suppressing their languages and cultures, and outlawing spiritual practices… (emphasis added).
It would not be possible for the Canadian federal government to back-track on this statement in order to now suppress or outlaw the culture or practices of Canadian Muslims. In accordance with the official policy of multiculturalism, as outlined by the Canadian federal government, Canadians are entitled to retain cultural diversity and at the same time, participate fully in Canadian society regardless of ethnic or national origins.
While it may be argued that the face veil damages community relations, there is a need for evidence to support how exactly the niqab or burqa causes damage or harm to any society. Also, how much of a positive impact would removal of the veil realistically have on social cohesion amidst growing anti-Muslim sentiment across secular nations? Social cohesion requires a level of acceptance, compromise, or accommodation of the “other” in any given country that takes pride in secular values such as freedom of conscience and freedom of religion. Similarly, integration incorporates coexistence, inclusive of religious and cultural diversity. Integration is often interpreted as assimilation, and thus failure to assimilate is interpreted as failing to integrate. When politicians reject a religiously defined piece of clothing under the pretext of promoting social cohesion or integration, it is evident that their words and actions fail to promote either. In this respect, their argument fails to convince.
Security Threat: Veiled Terror
Perhaps an argument that carries some weight is that veiling or concealing the face conveys mistrust and rejection of others, as well as causing a certain level of apprehension or feelings of intimidation for those sharing a public space. Such reactions or sensitivities should not be unexpected in any neighbourhood, town, city, or country that is predominantly non-Muslim or ignorant of what the veil represents for the individual who chooses to wear it. In fact, it may be considered natural to react to something unfamiliar or alien with a certain degree of apprehension or caution. Unfortunately, such natural concerns and apprehension are often magnified through misinformation.
A common assertion is that concealment of the face prevents identification, thereby posing a security threat that is considered dangerous to society; this is the argument that has provided the basis of the ban against the niqab and burqa in France. In December 2006, some British newspapers reported that Mustaf Jama, wanted for the murder of a British police officer, Sharon Beshenivsky, supposedly fled the country undetected because he wore a Muslim veil. However, the British Home Office commented that “the claim was unlikely to be true as women can be asked to lift veils in identity checks.” A former British Home Office minister, Mr. John Denham said that, the absence of evidence to support this claim was potentially damaging because “veils are a very sensitive issue in our society at the moment”. It is incredulous that women would pass security checks with faces veiled at airports without detection, or without being asked to lift their veils in order to confirm identity matching unveiled photographs in passports. The same would also apply when accessing certain other services that require identity checks, such as at banks or post offices.
Crimes are often cited to highlight potential security problems relating to the niqab or burqa. In February 2010, two people entered a post office bank in Athis Mons near Paris while wearing burqas, passed two security guards without being suspected or stopped, threatened staff in an armed robbery, and escaped with 4,500 euros. It is worth noting that as with any other masked armed robberies, the men were eventually caught. In 2005, Yasin Omar, one of the 7/7 London bombers, reportedly used the burqa to escape the crime scene. Whatever the case, he too was eventually identified. According to police officials in Amman, Jordan, over a period of two years, 170 crimes were committed by 50 people who used Islamic clothing to conceal their identities. To put these niqab-related crimes or figures in context, there are an estimated 6 million Muslims in Jordan according to a 2009 report by the Pew Forum, and the CIA World Fact Book estimates that women represent less than half of this population. Notably, the niqab is worn by a sparse minority of Muslim women. In effect, these niqab-related crimes in Jordan have been magnified to further distort the image of the niqab, feeding fear and paranoia. Incidentally, according to the 2007 Small Arms Survey, Geneva, 126,000 arms were registered in Jordan, with a further estimated 500,000 more believed to be in civilian hands; perhaps it is unwittingly assumed that these crimes committed 170 times by 50 people did not involve use or threat of firearms. Yet, this has not prompted calls for an outright ban against firearms in any country. The concealed face in effect draws greater attention and criticism than the concealed weapon.
Certain extreme secularist Muslim groups and far right groups insist that the face veil poses a security risk and are demanding a ban against it in Canada. The outcome of any such proposal being taken to the Supreme Court of Canada would be interesting in view of the fact that Canadian law permits Sikhs to carry a ceremonial dagger called a kirpan. In the 2006 case of Multani v. Commission scolaire MargueriteBourgeoys, the Supreme Court of Canada ruled that banning of the kirpan in a school environment went against Canada’s Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
In Canada, women who wear a niqab represent a minority of Muslim women in a total Muslim population of only 500,000 in a country of 34.5 million. In Holland, some 500 women actually wear a face veil in a Muslim population of one million, and in Denmark the estimate is fewer than 200 out of 170,000 Muslims. In Australia, out of a total population of 23 million, an estimated 400,000 Australians are Muslim; community advocates estimate that fewer than 2,000 women veil their face. Those that seek to influence or steer public opinion often use ways of magnifying a situation, to make a “problem” seem greater than it actually is. Citing a few niqab-related crimes do not by themselves provide enough weight for legal justification of a ban against a religiously defined garment or item. To impose such a ban would imply that niqab-related crimes have become a widespread problem that needs to be brought under control to ensure public safety.
Sheer paranoia or suspicion on the grounds of a few cited crimes cannot by itself justify any ban. It is questionable as to whether anyone would be asked to remove a scarf from the face on a bitterly cold day, or whether a courier or security guard would be fined, arrested, or even suspected when he walks into a bank or post office wearing a helmet. In any of these cases, there is the option of demanding removal of the face covering upon entering such premises or during a transaction that requires security. At best, an inordinate legislative measure such as a complete ban can easily be avoided by demanding removal of a face veil when needed. Figures do not support a widespread niqab-related crime problem, and it would be disingenuous to claim that banning the niqab would deter potential violent criminals from their intended crimes; there has never been a shortage of options for criminals to disguise or conceal the face.
Concluding Comments
Undeniably, Islam and Muslims have come under increasing scrutiny in the global media since the two Gulf wars and the post 9/11 “War on Terror”. Terms such as Islamism, Islamification, and Islamo-fascism have entered the global vocabulary, feeding anti-Muslim sentiment and heightening fears of a medieval ideological invasion of free western societies. More recently, the human rights group Amnesty International stated that Muslims who openly show their faith face widespread discrimination across Europe. After the hijab, the face veil or niqab worn by a minority of Muslim women is drawing the most worldwide attention, and is arguably the most visibly distinct expression or representation of the Islamic faith in the public sphere. In the midst of greater economic and social problems affecting Europe, this piece of religiously defined clothing has become a focus for controversy and debate.
Much of the attention and suspicion surrounding the Muslim face veil has been aggrandized by magnified negative media coverage of the ills and extremes of the Muslim community. Sadly, it is ignored that every society, regardless of race or religion has its ills and extremes. A recent government-commissioned study revealed an imbalance and overflow of negative stories in the British media demonising Islam and the Muslim minority fuelling the flames of prejudice, and depicting them as the enemy within. The aggressive drive of politicians to gain votes from the far-right has also been implicated in the niqab being targeted. Michael Tubiana of the French Human Rights League, said that Sarkozy had targeted the niqab to demonstrate his tough stance against Islamists and immigrants and “…to compete with the National Front for votes in the next election.” Amnesty International’s discrimination specialist Marco Perolini said:
Muslim women are being denied jobs and girls prevented from attending regular classes just because they wear traditional forms of dress, such as the headscarf…Rather than countering these prejudices, political parties and public officials are all too often pandering to them in their quest for votes.
Thomas Hammarberg, Human Rights Commissioner of the Council of Europe, stated, “The way the dress of a small number of women has been portrayed as a key problem requiring urgent discussion and legislation is a sad capitulation to the prejudices of the xenophobes.” He also stated, “Much deeper problems of intercultural tensions and gaps have been sidetracked by the burqa and niqab discussions.”
Whether it is health or social problems, it would be reasonable to say that the impact of a woman covering her face for religious reasons would pale in comparison for example to the effects of alcohol consumption on society. However, an outright ban against alcohol consumption across Europe would be inconceivable, simply because it would go against majority opinion and the sense of individual rights. In the case of the niqab, it is worn by and supported by a visible minority currently facing worldwide anti-Muslim sentiment. Undeniably, in this context, majority opinion must be tempered and restrained by the letter and spirit of the law. As Thomas Jefferson said:
All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression.
Women who wear the face veil are generally known to be law-abiding citizens, however in today’s context, the niqab is viewed with suspicion, mistrust, and even hate. Kenza Drider, a 32-year-old mother of three, who opposed the French ban stated: “My husband doesn’t dictate what I do, much less the government”. However, she constantly fears being attacked, saying “I still go out in my car, on foot, to the shops, to collect my kids. I’m insulted about three to four times a day.” She described almost being hit by a car, as well as being subjected to verbal abuse such as “Go home”, “We’ll kill you” and even “We’ll do to you what we did to the Jews”.
The American social reformer and leader of the abolitionist movement, Frederick Douglass, said “One and God make a majority.” These words contextualise the religious conviction, strength, and passion of the Muslim women who choose to veil against the tides of growing anti-Muslim sentiment.
[Disclaimer: The benediction “peace and blessings be upon him” after the name of Prophet Muhammad has been omitted for the sake of continuity, and is left to the discretion of the Muslim reader to observe.]
First-Century Copy of Mark?
Posted: April 22, 2012 Filed under: Book review/recommendation, Christianity, Debates, The Bible 2 Comments »from The Bart Ehrman Blog
On February 1 I had a public debate in Chapel Hill with Daniel Wallace, a conservative evangelical Christian New Testament scholar who teaches at that bastion of conservative dispensationalist theology, Dallas Theological Seminary. I have known Dan for over thirty years, since we were both graduate students interested in similar areas of research: my field (at the time I too was an evangelical) was textual criticism, the study of the ancient Greek manuscripts of the New Testament and of what they can tell us about the “original” writings of the New Testament; his field was the grammar of the Greek New Testament.
The term “textual criticism” is a technical term. It does not refer to any study of “texts.” It is specifically the study of how to establish what an author wrote if we do not have his or her actual writings, but only later copies of them. In the case of the New Testament we have a highly ironic and problematic situation on our hands. We have thousands and thousands of later copies of the New Testament. But none of our copies are the originals or copies of the originals or copies of the copies of the originals.
The vast majority of our copies are from many hundreds of years after the originals. That in itself is not a problem, apart from a related circumstance. All of these surviving copies are different from other another, giving different wording for this verse and that verse, up and down the line, page after page over the entire New Testament. We don’t know how many differences there are among our surviving copies – by last count we had some 5560 copies in the original Greek language of the New Testament – but they appear to number in the hundreds of thousands. Most scholars think that there are some 300,000 or 400,000 differences among these copies.
The vast majority of these differences are completely unimportant, immaterial, insignificant, and don’t matter for a thing, other than to show that ancient Christian scribes could spell no better than most people can today. (And they didn’t have spell check! In fact, they didn’t even have dictionaries.) But some of the differences matter a lot, affecting how a verse, or a passage, or even an entire book is to be interpreted. When you change what the words of a text are, you obviously also change what the words of the text mean! And so it matters which words were originally written.
Over the thirty years since I first met Dan I have engaged in serious and rigorous research in textual criticism. It was the subject of my Master’s thesis at Princeton Theological Seminary. And then of my PhD dissertation. I have published seven books on the subject and lots of articles in scholarly journals. It is the field that I devoted the first twenty years of my research career to. Over that time I moved away from being an evangelical Christian who believed not only that we could reconstruct the very words of the original authors of the New Testament, but who also believed those very words were inspired by God.
The public debate that I had with Dan – who has himself remained a committed evangelical Christian over all these years – was about the former question. It was not over whether the words of the New Testament were inspired by God. It was over whether we can know with relatively complete confidence what these words are.
It is not surprising that Dan thinks we can know what they are. It would make little sense to say the words were inspired if in fact we don’t have the words. What good would it have been for God to inspire words that are now lost? I on the other hand have come to realize that despite our best efforts, we will never be able to know what those words were in many instances. We simply don’t have the kinds of evidence that are needed to be confident that our reconstructed texts – based on copies that are all full of mistakes from hundreds of years later – are exactly what the authors wrote.
In other blogs I will discuss various aspects of that question. Here I simply want to point out one issue that came up during our debate.
In the debate I pointed out that our earliest copy of the Gospel of Mark was P45 (called this because it is the 45th Papyrus [hence “P”] manuscript to be catalogued), which dates to around the year 200 CE – i.e., 140 years after Mark was first written. That’s our earliest copy. Between the original of Mark and our earliest copy there were something like fourteen decades of copying, and recopying, and recopying of Mark. Year after year it was copied. And the copies were being changed at every point. And then later copies were copies of the earlier changed copies. Then those earlier changed copies were lost; as were the copies based on them; and the copies based on them. Until our earliest surviving copy, P45 – which itself is not a complete copy of Mark, but highly fragmentary. Our first complete copy of Mark dates to around the year 360 – nearly three hundred years (count them 300 years) after the “original” of Mark.
In his response to my discussion in the debate, Dan made a surprise announcement. We now have a first-century copy of Mark, he told the astonished audience (and the astonished Bart). When asked, he would not, or could not, tell us very much about this first-century copy of Mark. But it is obviously very important to know the details:
- How extensive is this copy? Is it a complete copy of Mark? Or a fragment? If it is a fragment, how much text is found on it? Twelve chapters? Two verses? It obviously makes an enormous difference! But Dan would not say.
- How was it dated? Dan would not say.
- Who dated it? Dan would not say
- Has anyone corroborated the dating by rigorous testing. Dan would not say.
All Dan would say is that the manuscript had been discovered; it had been dated by a renowned (but unnamed) palaeographer (i.e., expert in ancient handwriting: that’s how ancient manuscripts are dated, by analyzing the handwriting) who “had no theological bias” (I was not sure why Dan made that point; what does theology have to do with the dates of ancient handwriting); and that it would be published by the respectable publishing house E. J. Brill “in about a year.”
I have lots to say about this remarkable announcement, some of which I will say here in this public forum and some of which I will reserve for my membership site. For this forum, I should say, first of all, that it struck me at the time and still strikes me now as a rather strange debating point for Dan to have made, and it makes me wonder if it really was simply to “score a point” rather than to provide helpful information. In effect what he was saying was that contrary to my claim, there was in fact a copy of Mark from near the time of original, that he had evidence that would counteract my views. But, in effect what he is saying is: “I won’t tell you anything about this evidence! Trust me on this one!”
I really don’t think a public debate is the place to raise evidence that you are not willing to talk about, and that if you aren’t willing to state what exactly the evidence is, then you shouldn’t bring it up (I have evidence, but I won’t tell you about it).
Moreover, I don’t understand why there is so much secrecy about this “manuscript.” Why NOT tell us where it was found, who found it, how extensive it is, who has examined it, what his grounds for dating it were, whether his views have been independently corroborated? Is it so more people will buy the book when it comes out? Is this secrecy driven by a profit motive? If not, why the secrecy?
Dan has been repeatedly asked for more information, and he will not give it. I don’t know if he owns the manuscript, if he has seen the manuscript, if it is his book that will contain information about the manuscript, or anything else. The one piece of information that I have been able to gather is that we are not talking about a large manuscript with lots of text on it (say, several chapters, let alone all of the Gospel of Mark). It appears to be a scrap of papyrus with parts of a few verses on it.
The other thing I will say about this entire business is that publishing such a scrap as a book rather than in an academic journal where claims can be evaluated and reassessed by real scholars in the field is a very poor way to promote scholarship.
But let’s say that the dating is right, and that now we have a scrap of Mark from the first century. Let me be the first to say that I think that would be absolutely fantastic! It would be great! May many more appear!
Dan has gone on record as saying that this will be a discovery as significant as one of the Dead Sea Scrolls (see more here). He is wrong about that. In fact, if it is just a scrap, as it appears to be, then it probably will not change a single, solitary thing in the entire field of New Testament textual criticism.
UK MDI Debate: Is religion less relevant to modern society?
Posted: April 17, 2012 Filed under: articles by Sami Zaatari, Atheism, Debates, Islam, MDI UK Leave a comment »JESUS – Prophet or God? Islam vs. Christianity A Public Debate.
Posted: April 17, 2012 Filed under: Christianity, Debates, Islam, MDI USA, The Bible, Videos 12 Comments »Hot off the press MDI America’s latest debate
Guest Speakers:
Donald Wolan – Pastor and Mission Team Leader of Downriver Christian Community Church in Melvindale, MI
Shadid Lewis – Convert to Islam, member of the Muslim Debate Initiative & President of the Hampton Islamic Center in Hampton, VA
GLOBAL Upcoming MDI Debates – April 2012
Posted: April 6, 2012 Filed under: articles by Abdullah, Debates, MDI Australia, MDI UK, MDI USA Leave a comment »In the next 2 weeks MDI has 3 events, in 3 different countries, and 3 different continents!
Please click on poster to see the event details.
UK – 19th April 2012
USA – 12th April 2012
Australia – 9th April 2012
MDI Goes Global! Next Stop: Dearborn, Michigan, USA…
Posted: April 6, 2012 Filed under: Christianity, Coming Soon..., Debates, Islam, MDI USA 3 Comments »
Is Jesus God? | Muslim v Christian Debate: Abdullah Kunde v Jason Sabalow | 28 March 2012
Posted: April 6, 2012 Filed under: Christianity, Debates, Islam, MDI Australia 2 Comments »Islam and Reformation: What is the way forward? The Big Debate video
Posted: April 3, 2012 Filed under: articles by Abdullah, Debates, MDI | Tags: abdullah al andalusi, debate, islam, mustafa akyol, reformation, soas 1 Comment »Islam and Reformation: What is the way forward?
16th March 2012
School of African and Oriental Studies (SOAS)
Can Islamic civilisation be revived? What are the solutions for the
problems in the Muslim world? Does Islam need reformation? Should
Muslims borrow from Western Political systems? What is the way
forward?
Witness two speakers, with radically opposing views, debate and discuss this highly topical issue. Attendees will be able to ask questions and voices their opinions at the event.
Abdullah al Andalusi – Muslim revivalist thinker and International speaker
vs
Mustafa Akyol – Political commentator and Author of “Between Extremes: A Muslim case for Liberty”
Enjoy this controversial and exciting debate
Speaker’s Corner: Muslim/Christian dialogue March 2012
Posted: March 28, 2012 Filed under: articles by Paul Williams, Christianity, Dawah, Debates, Videos 9 Comments »Muslim speaker Paul Williams (me) in a discussion with a Christian preacher at London Hyde Park Speaker’s Corner, March 11th 2012. It takes about a minute before the dialogue actually starts (and I definitely need a hair cut). Comments and criticisms welcome.
UK MDI Debate: Is religion less relevant to modern society?
Posted: March 26, 2012 Filed under: articles by Abdullah, Atheism, Debates, MDI 2 Comments »Shabir Ally: ‘My Reflections on the Ally-White Debate’
Posted: March 25, 2012 Filed under: Christianity, Debates, Guest article, Islam 7 Comments »Did Jesus Claim Deity?
My Reflections on the Ally-White Debate
Shabir Ally
March 24, 2012
Christians and Muslims have been debating this question for centuries: “Did Jesus Claim to be God?” I would like to share some of my reflections on my March 22, 2012 debate with James White on the question. I noted in my opening remarks that in such debates both Muslims and Christians often focus on some selected key biblical passages which they cite in favour of their relative positions. Muslims would focus on those gospel passages which show the limitations of Jesus, and Christians would focus on passages in which Jesus makes claims that Muslims would not accept. Usually, both sides leave the debate claiming that they have won. Yet both sides distrust the other for failing to pay sufficient attention to the Bible’s verses which count against their claims.
For my contribution to this ongoing dialogue, I tried to make sense of the fact that the Bible contains both types of statements: passages that prove Jesus’ human limitations, and passages that prove a high Christology. Basically, I explained that Jesus was a man. This accounts for his human limitations. But over time, as the gospels were written one after another, the image of Jesus was transformed—especially so in the last of the four gospels. Jesus the man was made into a divine being. Thus in the gospels we have the surviving memory of Jesus as a man, and also the developed image of him as the divine Son of God.
I have just read Dr. White’s comments on the debate as they appear on his blog. I find his comments fascinating and, as usual, one-sided. Hence I am prompted to share another side to the story. After all our discussion over the years, I am surprised that Dr. White still holds to positions which I have already refuted. For example, he holds to his standard argument that whereas I rely on liberal scholars to deconstruct the Bible, I do not rely on such scholars to deconstruct the Quran. But I answered him in writing about this in 2008. My article “On Consistency in Muslim-Christian Debates” can be read here http://shabirally.wordpress.com/2008/12/29/on-consistency-in-muslim-christian-debates-3/.
Similarly, a lot of our discussion over the years has focused on the more specific question of which Christian scholars I should cite in my debates. In 2006, I had appealed for Dr. White’s understanding on this matter in my article: “Understanding the Rules Regarding the Use of Scholarly Citations.” The article can be read here: http://answeringmissionaries.wordpress.com/?s=citation+of+scholars. I would have hoped that by now, after all my explanations both in writing and in person, I could get through to Dr. White. Yet it seems that in each encounter we are starting again from the beginning. Dr. White would not accept the facts to which I appeal, nor would he accept the statements of the Christian scholars I cite—even conservative Christian scholars.
Obviously, I will have to try again both in listening to Dr. White on this question and in expressing my own view on the matter in the hope of overcoming this impasse. Meanwhile, I took Dr. White’s silence on my previous articles as his acceptance of what I have written. Obviously, this was an incorrect assumption. My request to Dr. White, therefore, is that he should kindly respond in writing to the two articles mentioned above, and also to my present reflection on the recent debate.
As I explained again in the recent debate, I do use all kinds of scholarship in my study of both Islam and Christianity. Naturally, I would be biased in favour of what I already believe. However, I try to put aside what I think I know so as to approach my studies with a neutral stance. I then explore a wide variety of writings on the subjects, and try to assimilate all of this information in a meaningful way. I do that for both Islam and Christianity. I do not accept everything said in favour of Islam. Nor do I reject everything said in disfavour of Christianity. In the end, I must weigh the evidence and form a consistent holistic view that incorporates all of the available evidence.
In my opening presentation, I tried to explain two different approaches to the question. In an academic setting, we would be expected to use approaches that are religiously neutral. Obviously, however, the demand of the debate was that I represent a Muslim perspective. Hence I explained how the fact that I am a Muslim can affect which conclusions of historical scholars on Jesus I accept or reject. Obviously, to reject a historical conclusion simply because I am a Muslim would be academically irresponsible. However, historical conclusions do contain a certain subjective element. Where I recognise such a subjective element I have to ask if I have stronger reasons from my faith perspective for rejecting the subjective element in historical studies. In particular, since our topic was on the question of Jesus, I pointed out that I do not, as a Muslim, accept the conclusion of those historians who claim that Jesus uttered failed prophecies. To Muslims, Jesus was a true prophet. If I were dealing with the subject from a purely historical point of view, suspending my Muslim faith for the exercise, that would be a different matter. But, as long as I am speaking as a Muslim, I have to reject the historians’ conclusion that Jesus uttered certain failed prophecies.
White’s claim that I build my case on the findings of liberal scholars is not correct. It is true that as a Muslim I would naturally tend to accept critical judgements on matters of the Christian faith and resist such judgements on matters of the Muslim faith. But the matter does not end there. In the end, my acceptance or rejection of what scholars say is based on my evaluation of the facts of the matters at hand. I have tried always to find out what some of the most conservative of Christian scholars say on issues. As much as I read material that is critical of Christianity, I also read defences of the Christian faith. Much of what I argue for are conclusions that are so clear that even conservative Christian scholars accept the basic facts even if my way of connecting the dots between those facts is unique.
Over the years, I have attempted to find a way of conveying these facts to Dr. White. In view of his rejection of the scholars I have cited in my favour, I have tried to ascertain from him which scholars he would accept. During the recent debate I asked White if Richard Bauckham is a conservative scholar. He gave a non-verbal response which indicated that he is not sure what to say of Bauckham. I was surprised at his hesitation, since Bauckham is widely regarded as a conservative scholar. I then asked White if F.F. Bruce was a conservative scholar. His answer was a definite affirmative. I was thrilled by his answer. I proceeded to present the position of Bruce and Bauckham. Both Bruce and Bauckham hold that Matthew and Luke based their gospels on that of Mark. Moreover, Bruce holds that Matthew and Luke made stylistic improvements to the narratives which they found in Mark’s Gospel.
I then argued that Matthew and Luke made more than just stylistic improvements to the narratives. I claimed that Matthew made eight sorts of changes to the story, and I supported each claim with an example, as follows:
- Matthew made people call Jesus Lord. For example, in Mark 9:5, Peter called Jesus “Rabbi.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 17:4, Peter called Jesus “Lord.”
- Matthew made Jesus describe himself as Lord. For example, in Mark 13:35, Jesus referred to himself as “the master of the house.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 24:42, Jesus referred to himself as “your Lord.”
- Matthew made people call Jesus “Son of God.” For example, in Mark 8:29, Peter called Jesus “the Messiah.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 16:16, Peter called Jesus “the Messiah, Son of the Living God.”
- Matthew made Jesus call God “my Father.” For example, in Mark 3:31, Jesus referred to God as “God.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 12:46, Jesus referred to God as “my Father.”
- Matthew made people pray to Jesus. For example, in Mark 4:38, the disciples, concerned about the storm at sea, awaken Jesus as he lay asleep in the stern. They say, “Teacher, do you not care that we are perishing?” But, in the same episode in Matthew 8:25, the disciples say to Jesus, “Lord, save us! We are perishing.”
- Matthew reduced Jesus’ emphasis on One God. For example, in Mark 12:29, Jesus, being asked what was the greatest commandment, replied as is known from Deuteronomy 6:4, “Hear O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one; and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 22:37-38, Jesus replied, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, and with all your mind.” Hence Matthew has omitted the words, “Hear O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.”
- Matthew reduced the distinction between Jesus and his God. For example, in Mark 10:18, Jesus said, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone.” But, in the same episode in Matthew 19:17, Jesus said, “Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one who is good.” Hence in Matthew Jesus did not repudiate the attribution of goodness to himself as he did in Mark.
- Matthew covered the human limitations of Jesus. For example, in Mark 11:12-14, Jesus was hungry. Seeing in the distance a fig tree in leaf, he went to see whether perhaps he would find anything on it. When he came to it, he found nothing but leaves, for it was not the season for figs. Jesus said to the tree, “May no one ever eat fruit from you again.” And the tree withered by next morning. But, in the same episode in Matthew 21:18, Jesus was hungry. And seeing a fig tree by the side of the road, he went to it and found nothing but leaves. Then Jesus said to the tree, “May no fruit ever come from you again.” And the tree withered at once. Hence Matthew did not mention that it was not the season for figs. Some Christians focus on Matthew’s depiction of this event, and use the narrative as a parable showing how those who refuse to bear fruit will be dealt with. However, by mentioning the fact that it was not the season for figs, Mark has shown that Jesus’ knowledge was limited.
Hence I have shown that the image of Jesus was being improved from one Gospel to another over time. I then added that the improvements which John’s Gospel made to the image of Jesus are even greater than those made by Matthew. For example, Mark shows that on the night before the crucifixion Jesus prayed in the Garden of Gethsemane saying that his soul is troubled. Jesus asks his Father to let this cup pass away from him. Nevertheless, he submits to the will of the Father. But in John’s Gospel, Jesus is not shown to be praying in this way on that occasion. In fact, even before that event, Jesus had already declared that he will not pray like that. Moreover, already at the beginning of John’s Gospel, John the Baptist had declared that Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. Hence this is a very different portrayal of Jesus than that which we have seen in Mark’s Gospel.
Furthermore, in Mark’s Gospel Judas’ kiss was necessary for identifying Jesus so that he would be arrested. But in John’s Gospel Judas’ kiss is not necessary, since Jesus comes forward to hand himself over. In fact, no one can arrest him against his will, since his very voice blows them over. He deliberately gives himself up because he has been given the power to lay down his life and to take it up again.
In this way, as we move from Mark to the later gospels of Matthew and Luke we find the image of Jesus being gradually improved. And as we move from Mark to John, we find the image of Jesus drastically improved. The Quran calls Christians back to the real Jesus as he was prior to such improvements which were made to his image.
It is thus clear that my conclusion was built on two major arguments. The first argument simply reproduces the finding of F.F. Bruce that Matthew and Luke rewrote the narratives of Mark with stylistic changes. The second argument is based on my comparison of the gospels to show that the changes were more than just stylistic—that they involved a major theological shift transforming Jesus from a man into God. To refute my position, it was necessary for White to dismantle my two arguments.
During the cross-examination, White surprisingly claimed that my theory is based on the claims of anti-supernaturalist scholars. I then had to ask him if F.F. Bruce is an anti-supernaturalist scholar. He said, “No.” What then is the problem?
Perhaps the problem is that the examples I have given to show the types of changes occurring in the gospels are not convincing. But, as far as I can recall without going over the recording of the debate, White only challenged two of my eight claims, the ones numbered 2 and 8 above. As for the first challenge, White asserted that the two gospels Matthew and Mark both use the term kyrios (Lord). I am surprised that White still makes this weak point after I had answered him in my 2006 article “A Reassertion that Matthew 24:42 Improves the Image Of Jesus Over that of Mark 13:35: A Commentary on a Point Discussed During the Biola Debate.” The article may be read here: http://answeringmissionaries.wordpress.com/2006/05/25/a-reassertion-that-matthew-2442-improves-the-image-of-jesus-over-that-of-mark-1335/
In that article, and again during the recent debate, I conceded that the term kyrios (Lord) occurs in both gospels. But, as I explained, Mark and Matthew use the term differently. Mark used it in construct with house to mean “Lord of the House,” or, better, “master of the house.” But Matthew changed that to “your Lord.” In my closing statement, I supported my position by showing that the same claim was made by Robert Stein in his The Synoptic Problem: An Introduction.
I am bewildered by White’s refusal to concede the point.
The second challenge came from White with regards to my eighth example. In his attempt to refute the point, White did precisely what I had said that some Christians do. White ignored Mark, focused on Matthew, and argued that Jesus surely knew the seasons. But, as I pointed out again during my rebuttal, Mark made it clear that it was not the season for figs. Hence Jesus’ limitation was clear in Mark, but covered up in Matthew.
A third challenge arose during the Q&A. A Christian cited a counter-example to the trend I have shown to exist in the comparisons between Mark and Matthew. In Mark 14:61-62, Jesus was asked by the high priest, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed?” And Jesus answered, “I am.” Mark here seems to be an improvement over Matthew. In Matthew 26:64 Jesus’ answer is ambiguous, “You have said so,” whereas in Mark the answer was definitely positive.
In comparison with the question in Mark, Luke has split the question into two parts, thus eliciting from Jesus two separate answers. First, in Luke 22: 67 the chief priests and the scribes and other members of the council make a simple request to Jesus, “If you are the Christ, tell us.” Jesus replied, “If I tell you, you will not believe; and if I ask you, you will not answer. Jesus continues with a statement that is present in Matthew and Mark as well. I give Luke’s version here: “But you will see the Son of man seated at the right hand of the power of God.” It was at this point in Luke that they all asked Jesus, “Are you the Son of God, then? (Luke 22:70).” Jesus answered here in Luke as he did to the single question in Matthew, “You say that I am (Luke 22:71).” In Luke, as in Matthew, the answer is ambiguous. Hence, in comparison with both Matthew and Luke, it would seem that Mark improved Jesus’ reply—that Mark turned the ambiguous reply to a positive one.
My answer to this challenge was twofold, though it had to be extremely brief given the one-minute limitation. The first aspect of my twofold answer is as follows. This episode in Marks’ Gospel is an example pointing to the existence of the hypothetical Ur-Marcus, a previous version of Mark, as the source of Matthew, Mark, and Luke. As I had explained to White during the cross-examination, scholars had arrived at the hypothetical Ur-Marcus in their reconstruction of the common source of Matthew, Mark, and Luke. But since the differences between Ur-Marcus and the present version of Mark is so relatively minimal, scholars found it unnecessary to keep mentioning Ur-Marcus. Rather, they found it more convenient to simply refer to Mark as the source of Matthew and Luke. However, in so referring to Mark, scholars would clarify, if necessary, that Ur-Marcus is the actual source. With this explanation already given, I do not see the question raised by the Christian gentleman as a refutation of my basic position that Matthew and Luke used Ur-Marcus.
The second aspect of my twofold answer is as follows. The two halves of the high priest’s question, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed?” are obviously meant as synonyms of each other. Hence, according to the high priest, “the Messiah,” means “the Son of the Blessed.” In that case, “the Son of the Blessed” does not mean “literally the Son of God,” as in “the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.” Thus, even in Mark, Jesus’ positive answer to the question does not constitute a claim to be God.
In short, two of my eight examples were challenged by White, and I answered both challenges. In response to his first challenge I showed that Matthew did change ‘Master of the House’ to ‘your Lord.’ In response to White’s second challenge, I showed that Jesus’ limited knowledge was clear in Mark but covered up in Matthew. Mark mentioned that the reason for the absence of fruit on the tree was that it was not the season for figs. By omitting mention of the season as the reason, Matthew thus avoided the problem. The third challenge to my examples, this coming in the form of a counter-example, does not hold up in view of my nuanced view which involves Ur-Marcus.
In conclusion, how did my above position hold up in the debate? It rested on two foundations. The first foundation is that Mark was used by Matthew and Luke, as is acknowledged by F.F. Bruce. The second foundation is that a comparison of the gospels shows that the image of Jesus was enhanced from one Gospel to another. Both of these continue to hold. As for the first, White could not show that Mark was not the source of the other two synoptic gospels. Nor is it fair that White would continue to charge me with depending on liberal scholars for this point after I have cited F.F. Bruce, the very scholar whom White recommended as a conservative scholar. As for the second point, that changes occurred from Mark to Matthew, the three challenges to my eight examples of do not hold up. And White made no attempt to challenge the examples I showed of changes occurring as we move from Mark to John.
As I pointed out in my closing statement, one does not need to be an anti-supernaturalist to see that these changes have occurred. One only needs to have a rational mind and be willing to look at the problem. I believe that many Christians saw the point, even if for some it will not be easy to accept this immediately.
Meanwhile, I hope that the approach I have adopted will lead both Muslims and Christians to a better understanding of the gospels and of Jesus. If my approach is valid, then there is no need for Muslims and Christians to walk away from the debate both claiming that they have won the debate while each remains suspicious of the other for having ignored key verses of the Bible. My approach is more sophisticated than the simple citation of proof texts. And it will take time for Muslims who have not studied the gospels in detail to master this approach. But when they do, they will find, God willing, that this approach builds better trust between Muslims and Christians. It also improves our mutual understanding of how Jesus was transformed by early Christian writings from a man to a divine being. This explains why it became necessary for the Quran and Muslims to reaffirm faith in the original Jesus.
I am sure that as soon as White is freed up from the demands of the conference he is busy with this weekend he will have more to say about our debate. I have mainly represented my side of the debate above. I expect that White will soon elaborate on his side as well. I look forward to reading his further comments. White suggested during the course of our debate that we should soon have another one on the question of salvation. I agree. And I look forward to that. Meanwhile, I await his written responses to the articles I mentioned above, and to the present reflection.










